E-Judo

Judo network and forum


    Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Share

    Happiness is a Warm Gun

    Posts : 8
    Join date : 2013-05-10

    Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Happiness is a Warm Gun on Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:34 am

    So there was a BJJ tournament in my area this past weekend, and one of the purple belts from our gym really cleaned up. He’s a big guy, coming from football before getting into BJJ, and I was impressed by the power of his standing game: he gets a grip and closes the distance, then grabs for a knee/ankle pick when he gets in, and if he can’t immediately finish the takedown he charges forward and transitions into a khabarelli throw right into side control. I’ve been trying to brainstorm Judo solutions to this strategy, but he outweighs me by almost 150lbs, so my options are fairly limited and my timing has to be very precise to put up any sort of a fight. In practice I’ve been able to frustrate him by stepping the leg grab and controlling his grips, but I am still powerless to defend the bull rush, so I thought it might help to bring this scenario to the forum for advice. Does anyone have experience grappling against a similar size mismatch, or ideas about a reliable counter to this attack pattern?

    Judoman

    Posts : 16
    Join date : 2013-05-11

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Judoman on Fri Oct 04, 2013 7:10 am

    If I’m following you, your opponent is grabbing you similar to what we call Hikikomi Gaeshi. After he has that type of grip, he grabs your leg to lift it off the mat. I would suggest working on defending the overhead grip. Also learning to move in circular patterns will really help deal with the “bull charge.”
    avatar
    Cichorei Kano

    Posts : 1948
    Join date : 2013-01-16
    Age : 857
    Location : the Holy See

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Fri Oct 04, 2013 7:50 am

    Happiness is a Warm Gun wrote:So there was a BJJ tournament in my area this past weekend, and one of the purple belts from our gym really cleaned up. He’s a big guy, coming from football before getting into BJJ, and I was impressed by the power of his standing game: he gets a grip and closes the distance, then grabs for a knee/ankle pick when he gets in, and if he can’t immediately finish the takedown he charges forward and transitions into a khabarelli throw right into side control. I’ve been trying to brainstorm Judo solutions to this strategy, but he outweighs me by almost 150lbs, so my options are fairly limited and my timing has to be very precise to put up any sort of a fight. In practice I’ve been able to frustrate him by stepping the leg grab and controlling his grips, but I am still powerless to defend the bull rush, so I thought it might help to bring this scenario to the forum for advice. Does anyone have experience grappling against a similar size mismatch, or ideas about a reliable counter to this attack pattern?
    I don't know the rules of BJJ, so I am unable to be of much use, but I will tell you this --take it for what is worth: unless you have truly exceptionable abilities*, or there is a huge discrepancy in skills between the two of you, it is unrealistic to expect to beat someone who is 150 lbs heavier. Give it up and save yourself the potential injuries.

    What on earth do you want to prove to yourself or anyone else by wanting to go fight someone 150 lbs heavier than you ? Just be patient for another 20 years if you want to experience what it is to feel pain or your body failing to achieve what it once could, or do you really find it necessary to speed up experiencing that feeling and in 20 or 30 years notice you can do even less than people your age, and can pinpoint the reason as something that went terribly wrong 20-30 years ago while fighting someone much heavier than you.

    ______________
    *Yes, I know that Isao Okano won the All Japan Championships with no weight categories, and I am sure someone will post a story of how R-Whatever Gracie beat so and so, while being 700 pounds lighter, all irrelevant unless you are serious in wanting to compare yourself and your abilities or even potential abilities to either.


    _________________


    "The world is a republic of mediocrities, and always was." (Thomas Carlyle)
    "Nothing is as approved as mediocrity, the majority has established it and it fixes it fangs on whatever gets beyond it either way." (Blaise Pascal)
    "Quand on essaie, c'est difficile. Quand on n'essaie pas, c'est impossible" (Guess Who ?)
    "I am never wrong. Once I thought I was, and that was a mistake."
    avatar
    Ben Reinhardt

    Posts : 794
    Join date : 2012-12-28
    Location : Bonners Ferry, Idaho, USA

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Ben Reinhardt on Sat Oct 05, 2013 3:50 am

    Happiness is a Warm Gun wrote:So there was a BJJ tournament in my area this past weekend, and one of the purple belts from our gym really cleaned up. He’s a big guy, coming from football before getting into BJJ, and I was impressed by the power of his standing game: he gets a grip and closes the distance, then grabs for a knee/ankle pick when he gets in, and if he can’t immediately finish the takedown he charges forward and transitions into a khabarelli throw right into side control. I’ve been trying to brainstorm Judo solutions to this strategy, but he outweighs me by almost 150lbs, so my options are fairly limited and my timing has to be very precise to put up any sort of a fight. In practice I’ve been able to frustrate him by stepping the leg grab and controlling his grips, but I am still powerless to defend the bull rush, so I thought it might help to bring this scenario to the forum for advice. Does anyone have experience grappling against a similar size mismatch, or ideas about a reliable counter to this attack pattern?
    You are going to need to be very much more skilled than him to succeed, as CK pointed out. I've been in similar situations in Judo. It's a tough row to hoe !

    Stay out of the absolute division if you value your health and safety.
    avatar
    finarashi

    Posts : 472
    Join date : 2013-01-11
    Location : Finland

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by finarashi on Sat Oct 05, 2013 5:01 am

    Its the basic bear and the dog situation. As long as dog is faster and can irritate the bear enough and doesn't let the bear grab him he survives but once the bear hits it is over. If someone is fairly athletic and 150 lbs heavier then you and him should not fight.


    _________________
    ... even professors make mistakes!
    avatar
    Q mystic

    Posts : 319
    Join date : 2013-02-10

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Q mystic on Sun Oct 06, 2013 8:45 am

    Serious Happy?

    A good straight drop seoinage here will get you a score, or a low back injury. 50/50. Maybe 60/40.Very Happy


    _________________
    Judo should adopt Sambo shorts to keep low attacks clean.

    medo

    Posts : 276
    Join date : 2012-12-31

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by medo on Sun Oct 06, 2013 7:54 pm

    Happiness is a Warm Gun wrote:So there was a BJJ tournament in my area this past weekend, and one of the purple belts from our gym really cleaned up. He’s a big guy, coming from football before getting into BJJ, and I was impressed by the power of his standing game: he gets a grip and closes the distance, then grabs for a knee/ankle pick when he gets in, and if he can’t immediately finish the takedown he charges forward and transitions into a khabarelli throw right into side control. I’ve been trying to brainstorm Judo solutions to this strategy, but he outweighs me by almost 150lbs, so my options are fairly limited and my timing has to be very precise to put up any sort of a fight. In practice I’ve been able to frustrate him by stepping the leg grab and controlling his grips, but I am still powerless to defend the bull rush, so I thought it might help to bring this scenario to the forum for advice. Does anyone have experience grappling against a similar size mismatch, or ideas about a reliable counter to this attack pattern?
    Reminds me of my teens/early twenties when I as a lightweight would fight local opens and have a go with anyone and everyone. By my mid twenties I became a lot more selective of who I practiced with and even refused to practice with some what I term "gorillas" as they went out of there way to cause pain due to their frustration from being caught or me not being there when attacked, consequences of that is back surgery in my fifties.

    Also brings to mind a neighbour when I was a teenager who was a builder I used to do some cash in hand for him back then. The bags of cement were 50kg each(now 25kg) and he used to pick them up and walk them to the mixer and hoof the whole bag in. He put his back out and ended up in a wheel chair, lost his home his wife and ended up taking his life.

    look after yourself and be cautious.

    Happiness is a Warm Gun

    Posts : 8
    Join date : 2013-05-10

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Happiness is a Warm Gun on Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:41 am

    I guess I was just trying to bite off more than I could chew. I'm always the smallest guy in the gym and the lightest guy at the tournament, and after a decade of training under those circumstances I like to feel like I could beat anybody with enough preparation. But you guys are right- satisfying the insecurities that come along with my Napoleon complex and proving myself against bigger guys is great, but not worth adding something really serious to my growing list of injuries. Thanks for the (bittersweet) reality check!
    avatar
    Q mystic

    Posts : 319
    Join date : 2013-02-10

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Q mystic on Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:14 am

    Happiness is a Warm Gun wrote:I guess I was just trying to bite off more than I could chew. I'm always the smallest guy in the gym and the lightest guy at the tournament, and after a decade of training under those circumstances I like to feel like I could beat anybody with enough preparation. But you guys are right- satisfying the insecurities that come along with my Napoleon complex and proving myself against bigger guys is great, but not worth adding something really serious to my growing list of injuries. Thanks for the (bittersweet) reality check!
    Pyrric war, Happy. You might win, but at too much threat of injury.

    Just win the first one, then claim injury and say that you cannot serious randori with him anymore because he inadvertently causes injury. Very Happy 




    _________________
    Judo should adopt Sambo shorts to keep low attacks clean.

    tafftaz

    Posts : 330
    Join date : 2012-12-31
    Age : 52
    Location : Wales, UK

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by tafftaz on Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:51 am

    A story from my shiai days in the pre-masters era.
    I used to compete in a lot of open weight categories as well as my own.
    I used to compete in the u95kgs at one point, then u86kgs. They then changed the weight categories so now its u90kgs.
    So not what I would call a small man. My attitude was always one of "just have a go" and I would often be up against men 40-50kgs heavier.
    This came to a sudden stop when I was 39 years old when I entered an open weight just after winning my weight and got knocked out cold by a younger and much bigger guy. Not entered an open since. Just stick to my natural weight category in masters shiai.
    Not worth the risk anymore.

    Sponsored content

    Re: Judo solutions to BJJ problems

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:13 pm