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    Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

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    noboru

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    Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by noboru on Thu Sep 11, 2014 9:13 am

    It is known that Jigoro Kano introduced two main ideas in his philosophy of judo.
    First was: Seiryoku Zenyo 精力善用 "make good use of your strength"
    Second was: Jita Kyoei 自他共栄 "look to the mutual benefit of yourself and of others"

    Yasuhiro Yamashita in his interview from 2004 sums up the ideas:
    "This means that we should make the best use of our own energy to do the right thing, to respect others, and to build a better society for oneself and for others. The essence of the spirit of judo is contained here."

    Someone may have the opinion that these Kano ideas are very idealistic, poor or unusable. It may be true, but I think it might be interesting to deal with specific Kano examples of the use of ideas in practice or in everydaily life. It would certainly help to better understand the meaning and concept of Kano's judo ideals. Jigoro Kano certainly in their journey through the world and lectures or Mondo, Kagami Biraki in Kodokan, Kodokan magazines tried to clarify many listeners...

    Therefore, I would like to take this forum and thread to gather his quotes examples or memories of his personal explanation. If you know, please contribute quotes, or text, or your opinion.
    Thank you.

    noboru

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    Kano speak about argument and debate

    Post by noboru on Thu Sep 11, 2014 9:15 am

    The book: Judo Memoirs of Jigoro Kano by Brian N. Watson, page 138-139

    To give an example of Kano`s insight, I recollect that Trevor Pryce Leggett, who in his youth attended lectures in London given by Kano, mentioned the following, and I quote, "I remembered when I heard Kano speak about argument and debate. I was then about seventeen years old, and very energetic. I sometimes used to get excited in an argument, and begin to shout. As I was big and even then fairly strong, sometimes my opponent would become nervous and would stop arguing against me. So I found this quite a good method of winning an argument. At least, I thought it was a good method. But Dr. Kano in his lecture said something like this, "In an argument, you may silence your opponent by pressing an advantage strength, or wealth, or of education. But you do not really convince him. Though he is no longer saying anything, in his hearts he still keeps to his opinions, only way to make him change that opinion is to speak quietly and reasonebly. When he understands that you are not trying to defeat him, but only to find the truth, he will listen to you and perhaps accept what you tell him." This was quite a surprise to me. But these words, spoken in beautiful English by this cultured Japanese gentleman, had big effect; my behaviour began to change. I realized that my thing quite unnecessary: namely, a desire to win. To bring in such a thing is against the principle of highest efficiency. Dr. Kano had recommended that we study the application of this principle everywhere in life, and my interest in it was now roused. I did indeed discover it as a sort of efficiency of the heart and mind, and found it in very unexpected places."

    BillC

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by BillC on Thu Sep 11, 2014 10:03 am

    noboru wrote:The book: Judo Memoirs of Jigoro Kano by Brian N. Watson, page 138-139

    To give an example of Kano`s insight, I recollect that Trevor Pryce Leggett, who in his youth attended lectures in London given by Kano, mentioned the following, and I quote, "I remembered when I heard Kano speak about argument and debate. I was then about seventeen years old, and very energetic. I sometimes used to get excited in an argument, and begin to shout. As I was big and even then fairly strong, sometimes my opponent would become nervous and would stop arguing against me. So I found this quite a good method of winning an argument. At least, I thought it was a good method. But Dr. Kano in his lecture said something like this, "In an argument, you may silence your opponent by pressing an advantage strength, or wealth, or of education. But you do not really convince him. Though he is no longer saying anything, in his hearts he still keeps to his opinions, only way to make him change that opinion is to speak quietly and reasonebly. When he understands that you are not trying to defeat him, but only to find the truth, he will listen to you and perhaps accept what you tell him." This was quite a surprise to me. But these words, spoken in beautiful English by this cultured Japanese gentleman, had big effect; my behaviour began to change. I realized that my thing quite unnecessary: namely, a desire to win. To bring in such a thing is against the principle of highest efficiency. Dr. Kano had recommended that we study the application of this principle everywhere in life, and my interest in it was now roused. I did indeed discover it as a sort of efficiency of the heart and mind, and found it in very unexpected places."

    Trying not to be cynical here ... but if there was ever a hope of such thinking becoming widespread within judo, it has lost ground. The "desire to win" has instead become the highest virtue, this is expressed clearly in judo culture and media.


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    Jonesy

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Jonesy on Thu Sep 11, 2014 5:24 pm

    BillC wrote:
    Trying not to be cynical here ... but if there was ever a hope of such thinking becoming widespread within judo, it has lost ground.  The "desire to win" has instead become the highest virtue, this is expressed clearly in judo culture and media.
    I cannot agree more BillC. This is a direct result of the direction that the IJF have taken judo, pretty much since it's formation as a Federation. In terms of judo culture, "the cooperative has been replaced with the competitive". In recent years that culture has been further reinforced and underpinned by aggressive commercialisation, and now seems permanently and irrevocably embedded.

    Ryvai

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Ryvai on Thu Sep 11, 2014 11:50 pm

    noboru wrote:The book: Judo Memoirs of Jigoro Kano by Brian N. Watson, page 138-139

    To give an example of Kano`s insight, I recollect that Trevor Pryce Leggett, who in his youth attended lectures in London given by Kano, mentioned the following, and I quote, "I remembered when I heard Kano speak about argument and debate. I was then about seventeen years old, and very energetic. I sometimes used to get excited in an argument, and begin to shout. As I was big and even then fairly strong, sometimes my opponent would become nervous and would stop arguing against me. So I found this quite a good method of winning an argument. At least, I thought it was a good method. But Dr. Kano in his lecture said something like this, "In an argument, you may silence your opponent by pressing an advantage strength, or wealth, or of education. But you do not really convince him. Though he is no longer saying anything, in his hearts he still keeps to his opinions, only way to make him change that opinion is to speak quietly and reasonebly. When he understands that you are not trying to defeat him, but only to find the truth, he will listen to you and perhaps accept what you tell him." This was quite a surprise to me. But these words, spoken in beautiful English by this cultured Japanese gentleman, had big effect; my behaviour began to change. I realized that my thing quite unnecessary: namely, a desire to win. To bring in such a thing is against the principle of highest efficiency. Dr. Kano had recommended that we study the application of this principle everywhere in life, and my interest in it was now roused. I did indeed discover it as a sort of efficiency of the heart and mind, and found it in very unexpected places."

    Wow, that is ironic! Thank you for posting that. I teach the same thing to some of the students at our university college learning about teamwork and entrepreneurship. I'll show you the picture of one of the slides I use to describe the difference between debate (goal: to win) and dialogue (goal: to understand). I learned this from a brilliant man (probably an ancestor of J. Kano) during an Olympic academy seminar, where the Olympic spirit (Olympism) was the theme.


    Anatol

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Anatol on Fri Sep 12, 2014 1:50 am

    Hi noboru


    noboru wrote:It is known that Jigoro Kano introduced two main ideas in his philosophy of judo.
    First was: Seiryoku Zenyo 精力善用 "make good use of your strength"
    I would not translate "Sei Ryoku" with "strenght" - maybe "spirit" and "force" blended together to "energy" is best. "Yo" with not only "good " rather than "best" - see also the translation for the quote of Yasuhiro Yamashita: "Best use of our own energy."


    Second was: Jita Kyoei 自他共栄 "look to the mutual benefit of yourself and of others"

    Yasuhiro Yamashita in his interview from 2004 sums up the ideas:
    "This means that we should make the best use of our own energy to do the right thing, to respect others, and to build a better society for oneself and for others. The essence of the spirit of judo is contained here."
    I would not say, that it is only our "own" energy - it is also the use of all energy, from which we are surrounded like air, water, nature in general. In Randori or Shiai the use of the energy of your partner or opponent.

    To Jita Kyoei: Mutual Benefit and respect and development of a better society and so on are not really specific for Judo. These values are Confician in origin and shared with so many philsophies, ethics and religions even firefighters have the same morals or pathfinders too and so on. So I dont think, that this is really specific for Judo and there is also a danger: People, who want the best for others are sometimes filled with convictions, thruth, altruism, rules so they miss what they intend, because they try to bring their concepts of life to others and sometimes with force. Generaly speaking there is no "specific Judo moral or ethics, it's blended from traditional japanese (chinese) thinking plus maybe some thoughts of pragmatic pedagogy and evolution of society.


    Someone may have the opinion that these Kano ideas are very idealistic, poor or unusable. It may be true, but I think it might be interesting to deal with specific Kano examples of the use of ideas in practice or in everydaily life.
    I think, that the first principle "Best use of energy" sometimes translated with "Maximum efficiency, minimum effort" is very usefull for my everyday life. Try to go with this principle for example when cooking. Do not cross the hands, go with naturalness and sinplicity, dont try to be too complicated. Same in Trading: Dont use force, overtrading, emotions - just make a decision, controll the risk and let the trade run. Even in singing: breathing deep with your body and do not press. Let the music flow but be aware and do not fear (one of the biggest obstruction for best use of energy).




    Thank you.
    Thank you too for opening a more fundamental and "non technique or "trick" based" thread.


    .

    Reinberger

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    Aren't YOU jūdōka?

    Post by Reinberger on Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:30 am

    I read this, and couldn't help to wonder about the rather apologetic AND resignedly tone of some of the comments here.

    Of course, I understand the regret, but aren't  YOU  jūdōka (I mean that expression in it's modern usage of "somebody who practices jūdō", not necessarily in the more traditional sense, that demanded a little more for somebody to be called jūdōka")?

    Who, for the life of me, should try to live up to the expectations expressed above, or who should try to foster that spirit, if he finds it to be commendable, within his own students, if not YOU? Excuse me, but I really think, not (only) the IJF, the Kōdōkan or any continental, national or regional federation or club represents jūdō, but YOU do it (also). Therefore, jūdō is and means, not least, what YOU make out of it. Could I really be in the wrong?

    And how could "Jita Kyōei" be "not specific to jūdō", if, regardless of it's origin, Kanō Jigorō, the very founder of jūdō, has established it as a maxim of his creation?

    Now, I'm a bit afraid my comments may sound a little bit too reproachful. But I don't know how I could formulate it better, and yet still to be able to communicate what I think. Sincere apologies, if somebody feels offended.


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    Ben Reinhardt

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Ben Reinhardt on Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:39 am

    Reinberger wrote:I read this, and couldn't help to wonder about the rather apologetic AND resignedly tone of some of the comments here.

    Of course, I understand the regret, but aren't  YOU  jūdōka (I mean that expression in it's modern usage of "somebody who practices jūdō", not necessarily in the more traditional sense, that demanded a little more for somebody to be called jūdōka")?

    Who, for the life of me, should try to live up to the expectations expressed above, or who should try to foster that spirit, if he finds it to be commendable, within his own students, if not YOU? Excuse me, but I really think, not (only) the IJF, the Kōdōkan or any continental, national or regional federation or club represents jūdō, but YOU do it (also). Therefore, jūdō is and means, not least, what YOU make out of it. Could I really be in the wrong?

    And how could "Jita Kyōei" be "not specific to jūdō", if, regardless of it's origin, Kanō Jigorō, the very founder of jūdō, has established it as a maxim of his creation?

    Now, I'm a bit afraid my comments may sound a little bit too reproachful. But I don't know how I could formulate it better, and yet still to be able to communicate what I think. Sincere apologies, if somebody feels offended.

    I don't think the ideals of Judo are original (not the original point of the OP) to Judo,nor are they specific to Judo. However, I do agree that in a pure sense, if one claims to teach Kodokan Judo, then the ideals of Judo as put down by Kano ought to be part of what is taught (in a Kodokan Judo program).



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    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:51 am


    Thanks.


    Last edited by Cichorei Kano on Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:48 pm; edited 2 times in total


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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by BillC on Fri Sep 12, 2014 3:39 am

    Reinberger wrote:I read this, and couldn't help to wonder about the rather apologetic AND resignedly tone of some of the comments here.

    Of course, I understand the regret, but aren't  YOU  jūdōka (I mean that expression in it's modern usage of "somebody who practices jūdō", not necessarily in the more traditional sense, that demanded a little more for somebody to be called jūdōka")?

    Who, for the life of me, should try to live up to the expectations expressed above, or who should try to foster that spirit, if he finds it to be commendable, within his own students, if not YOU? Excuse me, but I really think, not (only) the IJF, the Kōdōkan or any continental, national or regional federation or club represents jūdō, but YOU do it (also). Therefore, jūdō is and means, not least, what YOU make out of it. Could I really be in the wrong?

    And how could "Jita Kyōei" be "not specific to jūdō", if, regardless of it's origin, Kanō Jigorō, the very founder of jūdō, has established it as a maxim of his creation?

    Now, I'm a bit afraid my comments may sound a little bit too reproachful. But I don't know how I could formulate it better, and yet still to be able to communicate what I think. Sincere apologies, if somebody feels offended.

    Without writing a book about it ... some of us may be speaking out of experience on and off the mat.  If he were not "Yamashita" then the gentleman quoted would probably be ignored entirely by the greater judo community, and if made to listen many "elite" judoka would actively ridicule such thinking.  Accommodation, compromise ... turning away strength by yielding ... these are considered weak.

    Also ... they are very difficult to master.

    Here's some food for thought ... an example.  It is reposted from another forum, and came up as the 5th choice on Google when I was searching for "terrible judo kata" to study from.  I presume the poster thereforedoesn't mind it being quoted here.  There is a certain truth to the idea that competition is a test of principles in the physical world ... one must admit ... emphasis is mine.

    "You are the one who fails to grasp concepts. All you can grasp are dead techniques.

    I don't give a shit about IJF kata competitions. That's a waste of time, unless you're Japanese and do it as a cultural relic.

    I did test for my Shodan, I have the certificate from the USJI, I certainly performed both the kata and the gokyo (from both sides), but the point was that all that was window dressing. What told them I knew Judo was my competition record. I could apply the principles of Judo.

    You still didn't answer my question: do you compete? Are you any good? I've known a lot of guys who can quote Kano and perform beautiful Yoko Gake, but they don't know Judo because they don't and can't fight.

    It's ironic that you're having this argument with me, as I'm not really all that strong for my weight class and always relied on technique and timing. Ashi waza, Osoto Gari, and Tomoe Nage were always my best throws, combined with strong groudwork. I actually play very classical Judo, but I still disagree with all your characterizations of the art.

    If you're ever in Bloomington, IN on a Sunday at 12:00, come to the school of Health, Phys Ed, and Recreation, room 095, and we'll see whose Judo is better. Once again, who wins matters. It's all that matters. "

    What the poster doesn't see ... in my opinion ... is that judo competition is not a complete test ... just as passing driving school on a closed course does not prepare one for a SoCal freeway ... just as strong competitors come back to the dojo beaten up and crying because they got their ass kicked by punks at the beach, his illusion of invincibility ripped from him because of his incomplete training.

    Edit: It's also true that people who talk too much about principles and theories and concepts and philosophy indeed do frequently talk a great game which they cannot back up in the physical practice of judo. "Gentleness turning away strength" requires true gentleness when confronted with true strength. It's difficult to do. And too much "kuchiwaza" is not the best use of energy in this pursuit.


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    When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!

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    Anatol

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Anatol on Fri Sep 12, 2014 10:28 am

    Hi Mr. Reinberger

    And how could "Jita Kyōei" be "not specific to jūdō", if, regardless of it's origin, Kanō Jigorō, the very founder of jūdō, has established it as a maxim of his creation?
    Sure Kano has established "Jita Kyoei" for Judo, but it is massive influenced by Neoconfucianism

    see

    http://www.iep.utm.edu/zhu-xi/

    Philosophy of Human Nature and Approach to Self-Cultivation
    Moral Cosmic Synthesis

    Also the grading "stuff" ;-) and the bowing, the permanent learning, the seniority etc. and so on are Confucian.


    But going back to "Seiryoku Zenyo" and "Best Use of Energy" you even don't have to practice Judo to practice it in life. To use minimal energy for best result is a daoist thought and is often described with the symbol or metapher of "water". You can find these sentences in the Daodejing (Laozi) and in the Zhuangzi. Laozi 8: "Highest good is like water." "Very Good" in chinese is "shan4" and shan4 is the same as "zen" in seiryoku zenyo". Laozi 78: Nothing under heaven is softer or more yielding than water; But when it attacks things hard and resistant there is not one of them that can prevail. For they can find no way of altering it. That the yielding conquers the resistant and the soft conquers the hard is a fact known by all men, yet utilized by none." Naturalness and Simplicity.

    "Best use of Energy" means to me at first and very basic not to waste energy in life and to avoid destructions for body and mind and character and there are a lot of possibilities in life to go wrong and waste energy. Second, I do not try to get absorbed by all stuff like business, money, politics, status, knowledge, results, merit and so on. Third I use my energy for things and people I enyoy and do not want to get entrapped in fights and quarreling. Fourth its a kind of Ergonomy when working. Fifth I do not forget, that often its better do do something with less force but more natural. Natural things are fitting together and they dont need power. Sixth. Seventh, Eighth, Ninth ...

    All in all I think "seiryoku zenyo" is an important principal for everyday life and can help a lot to have a more natural and simple life, where energy is not wasted.


    .


    Last edited by Anatol on Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:40 pm; edited 1 time in total

    Ryvai

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Ryvai on Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:25 pm

    Ignorant douche wrote:If you're ever in Bloomington, IN on a Sunday at 12:00, come to the school of Health, Phys Ed, and Recreation, room 095, and we'll see whose Judo is better. Once again, who wins matters. It's all that matters. "

    What I imagine happening after a silly statement like that.

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Anatol on Fri Sep 12, 2014 8:04 pm

    Best to catch the idea of "best use of energy"


    is with examples.


    A confucian way (dao) would be to row or to swim up a river to the source
    a daoist way (dao) would be to sail or to float with the river to the sea.


    "best use of energy" is also depending on your aims so the more principle question are the subject and object of your aims.
    Even if you use your energy best, you can go a totally wrong way.

    This (maybe) is the reason, why Kano expanded the seyrioku zenyo with a moral principle jita kyoei.

    .



    NBK

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by NBK on Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:37 pm

    Reinberger wrote:I read this, and couldn't help to wonder about the rather apologetic AND resignedly tone of some of the comments here.

    Of course, I understand the regret, but aren't  YOU  jūdōka (I mean that expression in it's modern usage of "somebody who practices jūdō", not necessarily in the more traditional sense, that demanded a little more for somebody to be called jūdōka")?

    Who, for the life of me, should try to live up to the expectations expressed above, or who should try to foster that spirit, if he finds it to be commendable, within his own students, if not YOU? Excuse me, but I really think, not (only) the IJF, the Kōdōkan or any continental, national or regional federation or club represents jūdō, but YOU do it (also). Therefore, jūdō is and means, not least, what YOU make out of it. Could I really be in the wrong?

    And how could "Jita Kyōei" be "not specific to jūdō", if, regardless of it's origin, Kanō Jigorō, the very founder of jūdō, has established it as a maxim of his creation?

    Now, I'm a bit afraid my comments may sound a little bit too reproachful. But I don't know how I could formulate it better, and yet still to be able to communicate what I think. Sincere apologies, if somebody feels offended.
    Reinberger asks a good question.

    It is easy to be cynical but in reality most of the judoka I know are essentially unaffected by the IJF other than bits and pieces of changing competition rules. I would expect that most who read or post in this forum are the same.

    Anatol wrote:Best to catch the idea of "best use of energy"is with examples.

    A confucian way (dao) would be to row or to swim up a river to the source
    a daoist way (dao) would be to sail or to float with the river to the sea.

    "best use of energy" is also depending on your aims so the more principle question are the subject and object of your aims.
    Even if you use your energy best, you can go a totally wrong way.

    This (maybe) is the reason, why Kano expanded the seyrioku zenyo with a moral principle jita kyoei.
    Kano shihan was, to my mind, clearly in the Confucian camp of this discussion - he (repetitively, endlessly.....) describes judo shugyo as hard training (tanren). There's no loafing in his ideal world, no drifting with the flow. It's all about hard training and actively contributing.

    To that point, and to the point of the OP, here's an example, if I remember it correctly. My sensei's sensei was in his 70's and afflicted with terminal cancer. He showed up at the Kodokan for practice. Someone who knew him said, sensei, shouldn't you be home, resting?

    His response was along the lines of, look, I'm dying. You're going to die, too. But let's get on with it and I'll show you some judo, and I'll learn something, too.



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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Jihef on Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:44 pm

    NBK wrote:Kano shihan was, to my mind, clearly in the Confucian camp of this discussion - he (repetitively, endlessly.....) describes judo shugyo as hard training (tanren).  There's no loafing in his ideal world, no drifting with the flow.  It's all about hard training and actively contributing.  

    To that point, and to the point of the OP, here's an example, if I remember it correctly.  My sensei's sensei was in his 70's and afflicted with terminal cancer.  He showed up at the Kodokan for practice.  Someone who knew him said, sensei, shouldn't you be home, resting?

    His response was along the lines of, look, I'm dying.  You're going to die, too. But let's get on with it and I'll show you some judo, and I'll learn something, too.
    Nice one, that.


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    noboru

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    The Contribution of Judo to Education by Jigoro Kano

    Post by noboru on Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:25 am

    Thank you for your nice discussion. I found next text to this theme. I get only czech translation to this time.

    The Contribution of Judo to Education by Jigoro Kano
    This speech by Jigoro Kano was given at the University of Southern California (USC) in Loc Angeles on the occasion of 11th Olympiad, 1932.
    http://www.msisshinryu.com/articles/kano/judo-contrib.shtml

    The Contribution of Judo to Education by Jigoro Kano

    The object of this lecture is to explain to you in a general way what Judo is. In our feudal times, there were many military exercises such as fencing, archery, the use of spears, etc. Among them there was one called Jujutsu which was a composite exercise, consisting principally of the ways of fighting without weapons; using, however, occasionally daggers, swords and other weapons.

    The kinds of attack were chiefly throwing, hitting, choking, holding the opponent down and bending or twisting the opponent's arms or legs in such a way as to cause pain or fracture. The use of swords and daggers was also taught. We had also multitudinous ways of defending ourselves against such attacks. Such exercise, in its primitive form, existed even in our mythological age. But systematic instruction, as an art, dates only from about three hundred fifty years ago.

    In my younger days I studied this art with three eminent masters of the time. The great benefit I derived from the study of it led me to make up my mind to go on with the subject more seriously, and in 1882 I started a school of my own and called it Kodokan. Kodokan literally means a school for studying the way, the meaning of the way being the concept of life itself. I named the subject I teach Judo instead of Jujutsu. In the first place I will explain to you the meaning of these words. Ju means gentle or to give way, Jutsu, an art or practice, and Do, way or principle, so that Jujutsu means an art or practice of gentleness or of giving way in order to ultimately gain the victory; while Judo means the way or principle of the same.

    Besides the acquisition of useful knowledge, we must endeavor to improve our intellectual powers, such as memory, attention, observation, judgment, reasoning, imagination, etc. But this we should not do in a haphazard manner, but in accordance with psychological laws, so that the relation of those powers one with the other shall be well harmonized. It is only by faithfully following the principle of maximum efficiency - that is Judo - that we can achieve the object of rationally increasing our knowledge and intellectual power.

    Can this principle be applied to other fields of human activity? Yes, the same principle can be applied to the improvement of the human body, making it strong, healthy and useful, and so constitutes physical education. It can also be applied to the improvement of intellectual and moral power, and in this way constitutes mental and moral education. It can at the same time be applied to the improvement of diet, clothing, housing, social intercourse, and methods of business, thus constituting the study and training in living. I gave this all-pervading principle the name of "Judo". So Judo, in its fuller sense, is a study and method in training of mind and body as in the regulation of life and affairs.

    Judo, therefore, in one of its phases, can be studied and practiced with attack and defense for its main object. Before I started Kodokan, this attack and defense phase of Judo only was studied and practiced in Japan under the name of Jiu-jitsu, sometimes called "Tai-Jitsu", meaning the art of managing the body or "Yawara", the "gentle management." But I came to think that the study of this all-pervading principle is more important that the mere practice of Jiu-jitsu, because the real understanding of the principle not only enables one to apply it to all phases of life, but is also of great service in the study of the art of Jiu-jitsu itself.

    It is not only through the process I took that one can come to grasp this principle. One can arrive at the same conclusion by philosophical interpretation of the daily transaction of business, or through abstract philosophical reasoning. But when I started to teach Judo I thought it advisable to follow the same course as I took in the study of the subject, because by so doing I could make the body of my pupil healthy, strong and useful. At the same time, I could assist him gradually to grasp this all-important principle. For this reason I began the instruction of Judo with training in randori and kata.

    Randori, meaning "free exercise", is practiced under conditions of actual contest. It includes throwing, choking, holding the opponent down, and bending or twisting his arms or legs. The two combatants may use whatever methods they like provided they do not hurt each other and obey the rules of Judo concerning etiquette, which are essential to its proper working.

    Kata, which literally means "form", is a formal system of prearranged exercises, including hitting, cutting, kicking, thrusting, etc., according to rules under which each combatant knows beforehand exactly what his opponent is going to do. The remaining hitting, kicking, cutting and thrusting techniques are taught in Kata and not in Randori, because if they were used in Randori cases of injury might frequently occur, while when taught in Kata no such injury is likely to happen because all the attacks and defenses are prearranged. Randori may be practiced in various ways. If the object be simply training in the method of attack and defense, the attention should be especially directed to the training in the most efficient ways of throwing, bending or twisting, without special reference to developing the body or to mental and moral culture. Randori can also be studied with physical education as its main objective. From what I have already said, anything to be ideal must be performed on "the principle of maximum efficiency."

    We will see how the existing system of physical education can stand this test. Taking athletics as a whole, I cannot help thinking that they are not the ideal form of physical education, because every movement is not chosen for all around development of the body but for attaining some other definite object. And furthermore, as we generally require special equipment and sometimes quite a number of persons to participate in them, athletics are fitted as a training for select groups of persons and not as the means of improving the physical condition of a whole nation.

    This holds true with boxing, wrestling, and different kinds of military exercises practiced all over the world. Then people may ask, "Are not gymnastics [calisthenics] an ideal form of national physical training?" To this I answer that they are an ideal form of physical education from their being contrived for all-round development of the body, and not necessarily requiring special equipment and participants. But gymnastics are lacking in very important things essential to the physical education of a whole nation. The defects are:

    • Different gymnastics movements have no meaning and naturally are devoid of interest.
    • No secondary benefit is derived from their training.
    • Attainment of "skill" (using the word "skill" in a special sense) cannot be sought for or acquired in gymnastics as in some other exercises.
    • From this brief survey of the whole field of physical education, I can say that no ideal form has yet been invented to fill the necessary conditions for such physical education.

    This ideal form can only be devised from a study based on maximum efficiency. In order to fulfill all those conditions or requirements, a system of all-round development of the body, as a primary consideration must be devised as in the case of gymnastics. Next, the movements should have some meaning so that they may be engaged in with interest. Again, the activities should be such as require no large space, special dress or equipment. Furthermore, they must be such as could be done individually as well as in groups. Those are the conditions or requirements for a satisfactory system of physical education for a whole nation. Any system that can meet successfully those requirements may, for the first time, be regarded as a program of physical education based on the principle of maximum efficiency.

    I have been studying this subject for a long time and have succeeded in devising two forms, which may be said to fulfill all those requirements. One form is what I named "representative form". This is a way of representing ideas, emotions, and different motions of natural objects by the movements of limbs, body and neck. Dancing is one instance of such, but originally dancing was not devised with physical education for its object, and can therefore not be said to fulfill those requirements. But it is possible to devise special kinds of dancing made to suit persons of different sex and mental and physical conditions and made to express moral ideas and feelings, so that conjointly with the cultivation of the spiritual side of a nation it can also develop the body in a way suited to all.

    This "representative form" is, I believe, in one way or other practiced in America and Europe, and you can, I think, imagine what I mean, therefore I shall not deal with it any further here.

    There is one other form, which I named "attack and defense form." In this, I have combined different methods of attack and defense, in such a way that the result will conduce to the harmonious development of the whole body. Ordinary methods of attack and defense taught in Jiu-jitsu cannot be said to .be ideal for the development of the body, therefore, I have especially combined them so that they fulfill the conditions necessary for the harmonious development of the body. This can be said to meet two purposes: (1) bodily development, and (2) training in the art of contest. As every nation is required to provide for national defense, so every individual must know how to defend himself. In this age of enlightenment, nobody would care to prepare either for national aggressions or for doing individual violence to others. But defense in the cause of justice and humanity must never be neglected by a nation or by an individual.

    This method of physical education in attack and defense form, I shall show you by actual practice. This is divided into two kinds of exercises: one is individual exercise and the other is exercise with an opponent (as demonstrated).From what I have explained and shown by practice, you have no doubt understood what I mean by physical education based on the principle of maximum efficiency. Although I strongly advocate that the physical education of a whole nation should be conducted on that principle, at the same time I do not mean to lay little emphasis on athletics and various kinds of martial exercise. Although they cannot be deemed appropriate as a physical education of a whole nation, yet as a culture or a group or groups of persons, they have their special value and I by no means wish to discourage them, especially Randori in Judo.

    One great value of Randori lies in the abundance of movements it affords for physical development. Another value is that every movement has some purpose and is executed with spirit, while in ordinary gymnastics exercises movements lack interest. The object of a systematic physical training in Judo is not only to develop the body but to enable a man or a woman to have a perfect control over mind and body and make him or her ready to meet any emergency whether that be a pure accident or an attack by others.

    Although exercise in Judo is generally conducted between two persons, both in Kata and in Randori, and in a room specially prepared for the purpose, yet that is not always necessary. It can be practiced by a group or by a single person, on the playground, or in an ordinary room. People imagine that falling in Randori is attended with pain and sometimes with danger. But a brief explanation of the way one is taught to fall will enable them to understand that there is no such pain or danger.

    To take still another instance, in Randori, we teach the learner, when he faces an opponent who is madly excited, to score a victory over him, not by directly resisting him with might and main, but by playing him till the very fury and power of the latter expends itself.

    The usefulness of this attitude in everyday transactions with others is patent. As is well known, no amount of reasoning could avail us when a person who is so agitated as to seem to have lost his temper confronts us. All that we have to do in such a case is to wait until his passion wears itself out. All these teachings we learn from the practice of Randori. Their application to the conduct of daily affairs is a very interesting subject of study and is valuable as an intellectual training for young minds.

    I will finish my talk about the intellectual phase of Judo by referring shortly to the rational means of increasing knowledge and intellectual power. If we closely observe society, we notice everywhere the way in which we foolishly expend our energy in the acquisition of knowledge. All our surroundings are always giving us opportunities? Are we always making the best choice of books, magazines and newspapers we read? Do we not often find out that the energy which might have been spent for acquiring useful knowledge is often used for amassing knowledge which is prejudicial not only to self but also to society?

    I shall now proceed to speak of the intellectual phase of Judo. Mental training in Judo can be done by Kata as well as by competition between two persons, using all the resources at their command and obeying the prescribed rules of Judo, both parties must always be wide awake, and be endeavoring to find out weak points of the opponent, being ready to attack whenever opportunity allows. Such an attitude of mind in devising means of attack tends to make the pupil earnest, sincere, thoughtful, cautious and deliberate in all his dealings. At the same time one is trained for quick decision and prompt action, because in Randori unless one decides quickly and acts promptly he will always lose his opportunity either in attacking or in defending.

    Again, in Randori each contestant cannot tell what his opponent is going to do, so each must be prepared to meet any sudden attack by the other. Habituated to this kind of mental attitude, he develops a high degree of mental composure, or "poise." Exercise of the power of attention and observation in the gymnasium or place of training, naturally develops such power, which is so useful in daily life.

    For devising means of defeating an opponent, the exercise of the power of imagination, of reasoning and of judgment, is indispensable, and such power is naturally developed in Randori. Again as the study of Randori is the study of the relation, mental and physical, existing between two competing parties, hundreds of valuable lessons may be derived from this study, but I will content myself for the present by giving a few more examples. In Randori we teach the pupil always to act on the fundamental principle of Judo, no matter how physically inferior his opponent may seem to him and even if he can by sheer strength easily overcome the other. If he acts against this principle the opponent will never be convinced of his defeat, whatever brutal strength may have been used on him. It is hardly necessary to call your attention to the fact that the way to convince your opponent in an argument is not to push this or that advantage over him, be it from power, from knowledge or from wealth, but to persuade him in accordance with the inviolable rules of logic. This lesson that persuasion, not coercion, is efficacious, which is so valuable in actual life, we may learn from Randori.

    Again we teach the learner, when he has recourse to any trick in overcoming his opponent, to employ only as much of his force as is absolutely required for the purpose in question, cautioning him against either an over or under exertion of force. There are not a few cases in which people fail in what they undertake simply because they go too far, not knowing where to stop, and vice versa.

    To take still another instance, in Randori, we teach the learner, when he faces an opponent who is madly excited, to score a victory over him, not by directly resisting him with might and main, but by playing him till the very fury and power of the latter expends itself.

    The usefulness of this attitude in everyday transactions with others is patent. As is well known, no amount of reasoning could avail us when a person who is agitated as to seem to have lost his temper confronts us. All that we have to do in such a case is to wait until his passions wears itself out. All these teachings we learn from the practice of Randori. Their application to the conduct of daily affairs is a very interesting subject of study and is valuable as an intellectual training for young minds.

    Besides the acquisition of useful knowledge, we must endeavor to improve intellectual powers, such as memory, attention, observation, judgment, reasoning, imagination, etc. But this we should not do in a haphazard manner, but in accordance with psychological laws, so that the relation of those powers one with the other shall be well harmonized. It is only by faithfully following the principle of maximum efficiency, that is Judo, that we can achieve the object of rationally increasing our knowledge and intellectual power.

    I shall now speak about the moral phase of Judo. It is not my intention to speak of the moral discipline given to students in the exercise room, such as the observance of the regular rules of etiquette, courage, perseverance, kindness, respect for others, impartiality, and fair play so much emphasized in athletic sports throughout the world. The training in Judo has a special moral import in Japan because Judo, together with other martial exercises, was practiced by our Samurai, who had a high code of honor, the spirit of which has been bequeathed to us through the teaching of the art. In this connection I wish to explain to you how the principle of maximum efficiency helps us in promoting moral conduct. A man is sometimes very excitable and prone to anger for trivial reasons.

    But when one comes to consider that "to be excited" is an unnecessary expenditure of energy, giving benefit to nobody but often doing harm to himself and others, it will be seen that the student of Judo must refrain from such conduct.

    A man is sometimes despondent from disappointment, is gloomy, and has no courage to work. To such a man Judo comes with the advice to find out what is the best thing he can do under the existing circumstances. Paradoxical as it may seem, such a man is, to my mind, in the same position as one whom is at the zenith of success. In either case, there is only one course to follow, that is, what, after due consideration, he deems to be the best course of action at the time. Thus the teaching of Judo may be said to lean a man from the depths of disappointment and lethargy to a state of vigorous activity with a bright hope for the future.

    The same reasoning applies to those persons who are discontented. Discontented persons are often in a sulky state of mind and blame other people for what is their own fault and without attending to their own business. The teaching of Judo will make persons understand that such conduct is against the principle of maximum efficiency, and make them realize that by the faithful observance of that principle they will become more cheerful. Thus the teaching of Judo is, in a variety of ways, serviceable to the promotion of moral conduct.

    Finally, I wish to add a few words to the emotional phase of Judo. We are all aware of the pleasurable sensation given to the nerves and muscles through exercise, and we also feel pleasure at the attainment of skill, in the use of our muscles, and also through the sense of superiority over others in contest. But besides these pleasures there is that love of beauty and delight in it derivable from assuming graceful attitudes and performing graceful movements and also in seeing such in others. The training in these, together with the pleasure obtainable from watching movements symbolical of different ideas, constitutes what we call the emotional or the aesthetic phase of Judo. I believe you have already come to see what kind of thing Judo really is, in contra-distinction to the Jiu-jitsu of feudal times.

    If I now state in a concise form what I have said, it might be summed up as follows:

    Judo is a study and training in mind and body as well as in the regulation of one's life and affairs. From the thorough study of the different methods of attack and defense I became convinced that they all depend on the application of one all-pervading principle, namely: "Whatever be the object, it can best be attained by the highest or maximum efficient use of mind and body for that purpose". Just as this principle applied to the methods of attack and defense constitutes Jiu-jitsu, so does this same principle, applied to physical, mental and moral culture, as well as to ways of living and carrying on of business, constitute the study of, and the training in, those things.
    Once the real importance of this principle is understood, it may be applied to all phases of life and activity and enable one to lead the highest and the most rational life. The real understanding of this principle need not necessarily be arrived at through the training in the methods of attack and defense, but as I came to conceive of this idea through training in these methods, I made such training in contest and the training for the development of the body the regular means of arriving at the principle.

    This principle of maximum efficiency, when applied to the keying up or perfecting of social life, just as when applied to the coordination of mind and body, in the science of attack and defense, demands, first of all, order and harmony among its members, and this can only be attained through mutual aid and concessions, leading to mutual welfare and benefit.

    The final aim of Judo, therefore, is to inculcate in the mind of man a spirit of respect for the principle of maximum efficiency and of mutual welfare and benefit, leading him so to practice them that man individually and collectively can attain to the highest state, and, at the same time, develop the body and learn the art of attack and defense.

    If we closely observe the actual state of society all over the world, notwithstanding the fact that morality in all its forms (religious, philosophical and traditional) is meant to improve man's conduct in society and make the world ideal, the fact seems quite the contrary. We notice vices, quarrels, and discontent in every level of society, from the highest to the lowest. While we are taught hygiene and correct ways of living in school from childhood up to mature age, we still are prone to neglect the rules of good clean living and of hygienic and orderly lives.

    The actual facts prove that our society is lacking in something which, if brought to light and universally acknowledged, can remodel the society and bring greater happiness and satisfaction to this world. This is the teaching of maximum efficiency and mutual welfare and benefit.

    I do not mean to say that our time honored moral precepts and hygienics should be shelved. On the contrary, let those precepts and advice be respected ever as they used to be, but in addition to these; our principle of maximum efficiency and mutual welfare and benefit should ever be paramount. This I emphatically say, because in this age of criticism and new ideas, for any teaching to have effect, it must have behind it, some indubitable reason of fact. We do not hear the thinking man today say, "Because I believe in such and such a thing, therefore you must believe in it, or, I came to such and such a conclusion through my own reasoning; therefore you also must come to the same conclusion." Whatever one affirms must be based on facts or reasoning which no sane person can deny or doubt. Certainly none can deny the value of the principle "Whatever be the objective, it can best be attain by the highest or maximum effective use of mind and body for that purpose." Again, none can deny that it is only by aiming at mutual welfare and benefit that every member of society can keep from discord and quarreling, and live in peace and prosperity. Is it not because of the universal recognition of these facts that people have come to talk so much about efficiency and scientific management and that everywhere these are being advocated? In addition to this, the principle of give-and-take is more and more coming to be the determining factor in the lives of all human beings. Is it not because this principle of mutual welfare and benefit has been recognized that from the League of Nations and the Great Powers of the World we came to meet for the decrease of naval and military armaments? These movements are also automatic acknowledgment of the crying need of efficient and mutual welfare and benefit. The educational forces of every country in which Judo should have a prominent part must further them.


    *****

    noboru

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by noboru on Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:27 am

    If you have any next Kano's texts or explanations to Seryoku Zenyo or Jitta Kyoei, please post it too here. Thank you.

    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:00 am

    Thanks.


    Last edited by Cichorei Kano on Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:48 pm; edited 2 times in total


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    "Nothing is as approved as mediocrity, the majority has established it and it fixes it fangs on whatever gets beyond it either way." (Blaise Pascal)
    "Quand on essaie, c'est difficile. Quand on n'essaie pas, c'est impossible" (Guess Who ?)
    "I am never wrong. Once I thought I was, and that was a mistake."

    BillC

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by BillC on Sat Sep 13, 2014 4:28 am

    Ryvai wrote:
    typical modern judo player wrote:If you're ever in Bloomington, IN on a Sunday at 12:00, come to the school of Health, Phys Ed, and Recreation, room 095, and we'll see whose Judo is better. Once again, who wins matters. It's all that matters. "

    What I imagine happening after a silly statement like that.

    The link was funny, and the humor appreciated but ... I did not label him an "ignorant douche" nor did I re-post his thoughts in order to ridicule him.  In fact, there is a great deal of logic in what he says ... if judo is done well, above all the blah-blah-blah it should work.  For him, it is the measure of judo ... and we must observe that in our world this is the predominant way of looking at what is called "judo."  The gold medal is the goal.

    By what means, to what end, for what wider purpose ... these are the points that Noboru is pushing us to think about.


    _________________
    Oh, East is East and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
    Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God's great Judgment Seat;
    But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
    When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!

    - Kipling

    Anatol

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Anatol on Sat Sep 13, 2014 7:45 am

    Hi CK

    Jita kyō-ei is clearly Buddhist influenced although it also echoes the Confucian Analects (Lúnyǔ 論語, pronounced in Japanese as Rongō), particularly concepts such as Jin 仁 (pronounced rén in Chinese and meaning benevolence)

    I don't see any buddhist influence to Jita kyoei. Don't see it from the Noble Eightfold Path and not from the Five Silas.

    But for sure Confucianism:

    Tzu-kung said, 'If there were a man who gave extensively to the common people and brought help to the multitude, what would you think of him? Could he be called benevolent?'

    The Master said, 'It is no longer a matter of benevolence with such a man. If you must describe him, "sage" is, perhaps, the right word. Even Yao and Shun would have found it difficult to accomplish as much. Now, on the other hand, a benevolent man help others to take their stand in so far as he himself wishes to take his stand, and gets others there in so far as he himself wishes to get there. The ability to take as analogy what is near at hand can be called the method of benevolence.'

    Lunyu 6.30 (translation by Lau)

    http://wengu.tartarie.com/wg/wengu.php?l=Lunyu&no=150

    If there is righteousness (yi) in the heart (xin), there will be beauty in the character (de).
    If there is beauty in the character, there will be harmony (he) in the home.
    If there is harmony in the home, there will be order in the nation.
    If there is order in the nation, there will be peace in the world."'


    Selfperfection, perfection of society and mutual benefit and welfare is not a buddhist thought - losing your self (anatta) and compassion (karuna) is.

    Where do you see the buddhist influence?


    .







    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Sat Sep 13, 2014 9:18 am


    Thanks.


    Last edited by Cichorei Kano on Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:49 pm; edited 2 times in total


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    "The world is a republic of mediocrities, and always was." (Thomas Carlyle)
    "Nothing is as approved as mediocrity, the majority has established it and it fixes it fangs on whatever gets beyond it either way." (Blaise Pascal)
    "Quand on essaie, c'est difficile. Quand on n'essaie pas, c'est impossible" (Guess Who ?)
    "I am never wrong. Once I thought I was, and that was a mistake."

    Anatol

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Anatol on Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:01 pm

    Cichorei Kano wrote:
    The concept of ji 慈 [pronunciation in Chinese] and benevolence and doing all the blahblah goody-goody-goodness to others is also Buddhist and derived from the Sanskrit maitrī मैत्री, and represents the first of the Brahmavihāras four sublime states and is one of the ten pāramīs of Theravāda स्थविरवा Buddhism, and of course also influenced by Mahāyāna Buddhism. Similar to the principle of ji-ta kyō-ei to strive for it is in Buddhism mettā bhāvanā.

    Hi CK

    Yes it es similar in striving and aim but it totally lacks the aspect of selfcultivation (there is no self in buddhism), selfperfection, selfdevelopment, development of moral and character and development of society as in Kano's "jita kyoei". It's more an universal connectivity and amity and compasion. At the end there will be happiness and peace for all but :-) this is also true für christianity, utilitarism and even communism.


    How do you live "seiryoku zenyo" and "jita kyoei" in your everyday life?

    Have these two principles influenced your work or your relationship to other beings or your way in general/specific? How?


    .

    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:09 am

    Anatol wrote:
    Hi CK

    Yes it es similar in striving and aim but it totally lacks the aspect of selfcultivation (there is no self in buddhism), selfperfection, selfdevelopment, development of moral and character and development of society as in Kano's "jita kyoei". It's more an universal connectivity and amity and compasion. At the end there will be happiness and peace for all but :-) this is also true für christianity, utilitarism and even communism.


    How do you live "seiryoku zenyo" and "jita kyoei" in your everyday life?

    Have these two principles influenced your work or your relationship to other beings or your way in general/specific? How?


    Thanks.


    Last edited by Cichorei Kano on Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total


    _________________


    "The world is a republic of mediocrities, and always was." (Thomas Carlyle)
    "Nothing is as approved as mediocrity, the majority has established it and it fixes it fangs on whatever gets beyond it either way." (Blaise Pascal)
    "Quand on essaie, c'est difficile. Quand on n'essaie pas, c'est impossible" (Guess Who ?)
    "I am never wrong. Once I thought I was, and that was a mistake."

    Reinberger

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Reinberger on Sun Sep 14, 2014 3:24 am

    As you may know already, I’m looking at Jūdō from the outside. That could be an advantage, as you have to observe a system from the outside, to get a full, or, at least, a more global view, and to see it as a whole. Regarding the cultural origin and heritage of Jūdō, it, ironically, may even make it easier to talk “honne” instead of “tatemae”. I write “ironically”, as, at this time and to me, it looks a little like if I would argue in the “tatemae” style of a (Japanese) jūdōka.

    For insiders, on the other hand, it may be a detriment as well, because they may think “what does he know … he doesn’t have the insight and all the details we know”.

    While Kanō Jigorō usually is referred to as the “founder of Jūdō”, regarding technique – “his” style of Jūjutsu, as I see it – I’d rather call him a “starter”, who, with technical influences by himself, of course (the emphasis of the importance of Kuzushi for the execution of Nage waza may be an example for that), has started a “joint venture”, that was named “Kōdōkan Jūdō” by himself. He, as well as many of the students, at different times, to different degrees, and from different sources, contributed to the technical development of the style, something that, amongst other things, may have separated this style from many other styles of Jūjutsu.

    But, for me, regarding the “Way”, the doctrine, the philosophy, the moral, and with that the intention, meaning, aim and purpose for practicing and teaching this techniques, Kanō-shihan is clearly THE founder of Jūdō, the originator of this specific “dō”, and therewith was THE man to define “Jūdō” and to determine the correct answer to the question  “What is Jūdō?”.

    Therefore, the question is: is there ONE Jūdō, interpreted with some differences, of course, as well as not really (let alone: fully) understood very often, or are there two different, independent entities, one “Nihon-den Kōdōkan Jūdō” abbreviated “Jūdō”, and founded/started by a certain Kanō Jigorō, and a second, the “Jūdō” practiced throughout the world today, that has nothing to do with the first one, apart from its derivation from the former?

    The first one undoubtedly includes concepts like “Jita kyō-ei”, as well as techniques like Mae mawari ukemi, Seoi nage or Kesa gatame. If there really is a completely different entity, also called “Jūdō”, it may include the last mentioned three techniques, without including the first mentioned concept. I don’t really believe that. I think, that, while there may be different occurrences in several respects, finally, in the strict sense, there is only one Jūdō, with important parts, or even the most important meaning of it, neglected by many.

    Some comments and/or questions regarding comments made by others in this thread:

    Ben Reinhardt wrote: "I don't think the ideals of Judo are original (not the original point of the OP) to Judo, nor are they specific to Judo."

    That may very well be totally true. But I think, since Kanō-shihan has determined them as maxims of his art, system or way, they, carefully attended or not by the practitioners, are integral parts of Jūdō.

    BillC wrote: ”… some of us may be speaking out of experience on and off the mat. …”

    Of course, I’m aware of the situation. Therefore I wrote: “… I understand the regret. …”. But for me a simple “status quo” doesn’t change explicit formulated, principal goals.

    BillC also wrote: “…many "elite" judoka would actively ridicule such thinking. …”.

    I’m also aware of this, and I even can understand such a behaviour to some degree, as, for most people, there are both: a time and age to win tournaments (and I know, that to be able to do this, from a certain level onward, is a very demanding task today, that requests all the energy that can be applied by a competitor), as well as a time and age to look for more (or, for something different, at least). Otherwise, Jūdō would be something, primarily, if not only, for children, teens and twens. For me, the example you gave from the other forum, clearly comes from someone being in the former phase. Or, he is one of the (assumably) many, that stay caught in that (pure “technical”) stage, although their time to win tournaments is long over.

    You also wrote about some things, that “they are very difficult to master”. Here I couldn’t agree more with you.

    Anatol, you seem to accept, that “Sei-ryoku Zen’yō” more often seen and acknowledged as technical concept than in its wider meaning, can be applied in life, “outside” of Jūdō. Do you not think, that, on the other hand, "Jita kyō-ei" as well can be, and should be, applied within the practise of Jūdō, by sensei as well, as by sempai, for example? Do you think, for emotional reasons as well as for health reasons, many beginners could be kept in a dōjō long enough, where it is completely neglected?

    Kanō Jigorō may have got his ideas, or even written out concepts from different sources, but nevertheless, he has explicit named it as parts, or better, even as goals of his Jūdō, and that’s why I think Jūdō proper cannot be defined without them. Moreover, I think Kanō was a wise man to do this, as in a modern, human society, fighting arts and –techniques like these HAVE to be embedded into, and restrained by, moral concepts.

    On the other hand, while there were similar techniques in other styles of Jūjutsu, perhaps Kanō-shihan have got the idea for his “Kata guruma” from western wrestling. The idea of Dan-i, that he introduced for the first time into a Japanese Fighting Art, may have been inspired by a system already used for Gō players at that time, and the Kuro obi he used since some time later to distinguish his graduated students, may derive from the ribbons used in Japan to label more experienced swimmers of that period.

    Do Kata guruma, Dan-i or the Kuro obi now suddenly no longer belong into Jūdō, because of their (possible) pedigree from somewhere else?

    BTW, Anatol, you cite the last part of Laozi 78 with “... yet utilized by none”. I always thought it is “... yet utilized by so few”. Is it really “ ... by NONE”?

    CK, you wrote about Sei-ryoku as Kanō’s replacement for the concept of “Ki”. While I think, that it may by such a replacement, and, to a certain degree, even a good one (and even to partly explain, what “Ki” could be), didn’t Kanō-shihan himself explain it primarily as his replacement of "Jū yoku go wo seisuru", or “softness control hardness”, a principle, for which’s imperfectness regarding his Jūdō he even gave examples?

    You also wrote: “Kanō was hardly an original thinker and about everything he wrote or did he copied from elsewhere and put together.” I’m sure, this observation is not wrong. I’m likewise sure, that it’s a typical attribute for "the", as well as "a", Japanese. They don’t seem to be the inventor geniuses, but they surely are people, who successfully try to bring to perfection everything they chose to adopt. Even in our times. I’m remembering well the times when, especially for electric or electronic devices, the label “Made in Japan” was a synonym for cheap imitations. But how quickly did they change that into a meaning of high, sometimes even leading level in that field!

    The concept of “Ji” 慈 undoubtedly is a Buddhist concept, even if it may be used elsewhere too. Harada-sensei, a priest of Wa-Buddhism and the founder of my school "Jigenryū" (慈眼流), chose that name, inspired by an expression used in the Lotos sutra. To him, Ji was a way to achieve Wa 和 (harmony, peace). And while Buddhism ultimately may be without self, Buddhists (still) are not, and the quest for self-improvement, to be able to execute mercifulness at all, may be viewed as venial “sin”.

    Taking into account the cultural heritage of Jūdō, to me it isn't a surprise, to find the same multitude of influences in it, as in the Japanese culture as a whole. Shintoism, Daoism, Confucianism, Neo-Confucianism, Buddhism, and so on. And even western influences, as Kano, and Japan at his time, was very eager to learn from the "West", and to become “modern”, after a long time of seclusion from the rest of the world. I think the whole idea of Jūdō as a “sport”, comes from this last influence, including Kanō’s efforts regarding the scientific examinations of “his” techniques.

    Regarding some realistic, even bitter remarks: I remember a good assertion I once heard, regarding the question of the goal, a budōka strives for: Perfection. Knowing exactly, that he will never gain it. But always trying, nevertheless. I don’t think, that that goes only for techniques or fighting capacity.

    Instead of telling stories of how good one thinks to have implemented concepts like Sei-ryoku Zen’yō and Jita kyō-ei in his own life, I think it could (perhaps in another thread, or much later at least, as the OP seems to primarily want to collect more of the original writings here) be of interest to discuss the question of when, where, and HOW exactly concepts like that can be “taught” at all, in the dōjō or elsewhere, something, that I’m contemplating for considerable time now.


    _________________
    Kind regards, Robert

    noboru

    Posts : 553
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    Seiryoku saizen katsuyô ->Seiryoku Zen’yô, Jita yûwa kyôei -> Jita Kyôei

    Post by noboru on Sun Sep 14, 2014 7:17 am

    The text below is not Kanos example of his ideas, but could be interesting for thema Kanos ideas. I meet with some similar informations in some sources related to Kodokan.

    Here are interesting french page with informations and explanations about sources, kanji meanings of Seiryoku Zen’yô, Jita Kyôei

    柔道の最高の目的 - jûdô no saikô no mokuteki
    http://www.shinryu.fr/881-judo-no-saiko-no-mokuteki.html

    Jack from shinryu.fr wrote:
    柔道の最高の目的 – jûdô no saikô no mokuteki

    柔道の最高の目的 – jûdô no saikô no mokuteki  – « plus haut but du jûdô »
    C’est le « slogan » de l’école kodokan de maître Jigoro Kano.
    最高 – saikô – « le plus haut, maximum »
    目的 – mokuteki – « but »

    Premier but:  精力最善活用 ou 精力善用

    精力最善活用 – Seiryoku saizen katsuyô
    精力善用 – Seiryoku Zen’yô

    Signifie: « La meilleure application de l’énergie »
    精力 – Seiryoku – « énergie, vigueur, vitalité »
    最善 – Saizen – « Le meilleur ».
    活用 – Katsuyō – « utilisation pratique, application ».

    Seiryoku saizen katsuyô : la meilleure exploitation de l’énergie
    Seiryoku Zen’yô : utilisation habile et bonne de l’énergie.

    Ce principe est la recherche du meilleur emploi possible des énergies physiques et mentales. Intégrant le principe de jû (la souplesse) et le dépassant, il invite à l’application de la solution la plus pertinente à tout problème: Agir juste, au bon moment, avec un parfait contrôle de l’énergie employée, utiliser la force et les intentions du partenaire contre lui-même.
    Seiryoku Zenyo est un idéal.

    Pour un Japonais, Seiryoku saizen katsuyô est avant tout une expression compacte et assez hermétique. Les caractères sont simplement juxtaposés et c’est dans le courant de la lecture que ce forme le sens, à la manière chinoise. L’effet de la calligraphie est d’abord un impact esthétique, au même titre qu’un tableau, avant de faire référence à un héritage culturel. Le sens vient ensuite, chargé du contenu émotionnel propre à ce mode d’expression, volontairement choisi par Jigoro Kano pour donner plus de force à son message.

    Deuxième but: 自他融和共栄

    自他融和共栄  – Jita yûwa kyôei ou tout simplement (自他共栄 : Jita Kyôei)
    signifie en mot à mot: « prospérité mutuelle et harmonie pour soi et les autres »

    自他 – Jita – « soi et les autres ».
    融和 – Yûwa – « harmonie, réconciliation ». (ne pas confondre avec 宥和, qui se prononce yûwa mais qui veut dire appaisement)
    共栄 – Kyôei – « prospérité mutuelle ».

    Jita

    Exprimé de façon elliptique : ji-riki, « sa propre force » et ta-riki, « la force de l’autre ». Ces deux termes bouddhiques expriment deux notions antagonistes : le premier signifie que notre réalisation ne dépend que de notre propre force tandis que le second exprime qu’elle est entièrement dépendante de la force de l’autre.

    Yuwa

    deux sens possibles: s’ouvrir aux autres et entretenir avec eux de bonnes relations, une bonne entente et/ou se fondre harmonieusement.
    Maître Morihei Ueshiba (fondateur de l’aikidô) parle souvent d’harmony, et lorsqu’il le fait, il utilise les mots 調和 chouwa et 融和 yuuwa. Parfois aussi 和合. 和 est pour moi, le mot pour harmony en japonais. Un grand exemple se trouve dans le livre de Robert Whiting sur le baseball Japonais « You Gotta Have Wa ». Lorsque les japonais se soucient d’harmonie, ils se soucient de « wa ».
    和 – wa – « unité, harmonie, paix, union »

    Kyoei

    Prospérer ensemble. Cela signifie prospérer selon les trois plans matériel, physique et spirituel, sans qu’il s’agisse d’en exclure aucun dans l’interprétation de cette formule.

    Signification

    On peut lire à propos de jita yûwa kyôei: Le principe est l’entente harmonieuse, la prospérité mutuelle par l’union de sa propre force et de celle des autres. Découlant de l’application sincère de jû (la souplesse) et de Seiryoku Zenyo, il suggère que la présence de partenaires et celle du groupe sont nécessaires et bénéfiques à la progression de chacun. En jûdô, les progrès individuels passent par l’entraide et les concessions mutuelles.

    Jita Yuwa Kyoei est une prise de conscience.

    Comme Seiryoku Saizen Katsuyô, Jita Yûwa Kyôei est une calligraphie. Pour un Japonais, elle éveille donc les mêmes effets esthétiques, émotionnels, culturels à la lecture. D’ailleurs, si le terme yûwa apporte un complément de sens indéniable, il semble qu’il ait surtout pour fonction d’équilibrer graphiquement et rythmiquement les deux expressions qu’elle complète. Elle est le plus souvent exprimée, par Jigoro Kano lui-même, par Jita Kyôei.
    JITA KYOEI : prospérité mutuelle par notre force et celle des autres.
    JITA YUWA KYOEI : entente harmonieuse et prospérité mutuelle par notre force et celle des autres.

    Conclusion

    Cet article a pour but d’expliquer les deux plus hauts  buts du jûdô et en aucun cas en donner une interprétation. Libre à chacun de faire une interprétation qui soit purement martiale, ou humaine et sociale.


    For not french speaking people / here is link to english translation from Google Translator.
    https://translate.google.cz/translate?sl=fr&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=cs&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.shinryu.fr%2F881-judo-no-saiko-no-mokuteki.html&edit-text=

    Jack from shinryu.fr and Google translator to english wrote:
    柔道の最高の目的- judo no Saiko no mokuteki


    柔道の最高の目的- judo no Saiko no mokuteki - "highest aim of judo"
    This is the "slogan" of the Kodokan school master Jigoro Kano.
    最高- Saiko - "the highest, maximum"
    目的- mokuteki - "purpose"

    First goal:精力最善活用or精力善用

    精力最善活用- Seiryoku Saizen katsuyô
    精力善用- Seiryoku Zen 'yo

    Means "The best application of energy"
    精力- Seiryoku - "energy, vigor, vitality '
    最善- Saizen - "The best."
    活用- Katsuyō - "practical use application."

    Seiryoku Saizen katsuyô: the best use of energy
    Seiryoku Zen 'yo: clever and good use of energy.

    This principle is finding the best possible use of the physical and mental energies. Incorporating the principle of jû (flexibility) and excess, it calls for the application of the most appropriate solution to any problem: Acting just at the right time, with perfect control of the energy used, the use of force and the intentions of the partner against himself.
    Seiryoku zenyo is an ideal.

    For Japanese, Seiryoku Saizen katsuyô is primarily a compact and fairly tight expression. The characters are simply juxtaposed and it is in the course of reading it as meaning, in the Chinese way. The effect of calligraphy is primarily an aesthetic impact, along with a table, before referring to a cultural heritage. The meaning then is in charge of this specific mode of expression emotional content, intentionally chosen by Jigoro Kano to give more force to his message.

    Goal Two:自他融和共栄

    自他融和共栄- Jita Kyoei Yuwa or just (自他共栄: Jita Kyoei)
    means literally: "mutual prosperity and harmony for yourself and others"

    自他- Jita - "self and others."
    融和- Yuwa - "harmony, reconciliation." (Not to be confused with宥和, pronounced but Yuwa means appeasement)
    共栄- Kyoei - "mutual prosperity."

    Jita

    Expressed elliptically: ji-riki "own force" and ta-riki, "the strength of the other." Both Buddhist terms express two opposing concepts: the first means that our implementation depends only on our own strength while the second expresses that it is entirely dependent on the strength of the other.

    Yuwa

    two possible meanings: open up to others and maintain good relations with them, a good agreement and / or blend harmoniously.
    Master Ueshiba (founder of aikido) often speaks of harmony, and when he does, he uses the words調和chouwa and融和yuuwa. Sometimes和合. 和is for me, the word for harmony in Japanese. A great example is in the book by Robert Whiting on the Japanese "You Gotta Have Wa" baseball. When Japanese care about harmony, they care about "wa".
    和- wa - "unity, harmony, peace, unity"

    Kyoei

    Prosper together. This means prosper in the three material, physical and spiritual, not whether to exclude any in the interpretation of this formula.

    Meaning

    You can read about jita Yuwa Kyoei: The principle is harmonious understanding, mutual prosperity by uniting his own strength and that of others. Arising from the application of sincere jû (flexibility) and Seiryoku zenyo, it suggests that the presence of partners and group are necessary and beneficial to the progress of each. In judo, individual progress go through self-help and mutual concessions.

    Jita Kyoei Yuwa is awareness.

    As Seiryoku Saizen Katsuyô, Jita Kyoei Yuwa is a calligraphy. For Japanese, so she wakes up the same aesthetic effects, emotional, cultural reading. Besides, if the term Yuwa complements undeniable sense, it seems to have mostly serves to balance both graphically and rhythmically it full expression. It is usually expressed by Kano Jigoro itself by Kyoei Jita.
    JITA Kyoei: mutual prosperity through our strength and that of others.
    JITA Yuwa Kyoei: harmonious understanding and mutual prosperity with our strength and that of others.

    Conclusion

    This article aims to explain the two highest goals of judo and under no circumstances give an interpretation. Everyone is free to make an interpretation that is purely martial, or human and social.

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    Re: Kanos examples of Seiryoku Zenyo or Jita Kyoei for everyday life

    Post by Sponsored content Today at 9:33 pm


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