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    medo

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    uchimata

    Post by medo on Mon Aug 17, 2015 7:13 pm

    ummmm!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qjz3XhzKcq8

    Rolling Eyes






    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Mon Aug 17, 2015 8:39 pm

    Oh for goodness sake.

    http://www.karlgeis.com/#!judo-promotion-requirements/c1k5t

    If I come to the club 4.5hrs a week for 11years I can become a rokudan Embarassed

    Lets all join and become delusional crap Judoka....


    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:07 pm

    Would you believe Ivan is an 8th dan??????

    Just watched more of Ivans vids he's mobile he's not restricted by bad knees/back/elbows like so many of us veterans who actually have practiced Judo.
    In one of the vids the class is clapping a demonstration worthy of a kyu grade done by Ivan.

    Its a bit like seeing those delusional singers on Xfactor who think they can sing but sound like a cat shi**ing razor blades.

    http://www.karlgeis.com/#!our-charter/ck4d

    BillC

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by BillC on Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:47 am

    Medo ... you seem to just have discovered these guys ... this thread and the one you shared with NBK. You might reconsider, maybe it's just too easy to pick on the weak. Your posts might not come across as gentlemanly. Plus, if these are the only candy belts you have ever seen operating without actually having met the usual requirements, then maybe it is your judo exposure that needs to widen a bit. They are everywhere you look, including on the JF and this forum "the son of JF."

    If you are really interested, there is plenty of fuel for this fire over on bullshido.com.

    Sorry for the interruption, it might not be my place to have written this, but I look forward to your usual, more positive posts.

    Cheers.

    Bill


    _________________
    Oh, East is East and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
    Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God's great Judgment Seat;
    But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
    When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!

    - Kipling

    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Tue Aug 18, 2015 4:47 am

    BillC wrote:Medo ... you seem to just have discovered these guys ... this thread and the one you shared with NBK.  You might reconsider, maybe it's just too easy to pick on the weak.  Your posts might not come across as gentlemanly.  Plus, if these are the only candy belts you have ever seen operating without actually having met the usual requirements, then maybe it is your judo exposure that needs to widen a bit.  They are everywhere you look, including on the JF and this forum "the son of JF."

    If you are really interested, there is plenty of fuel for this fire over on bullshido.com.

    Sorry for the interruption, it might not be my place to have written this, but I look forward to your usual, more positive posts.

    Cheers.

    Bill

    Yes just discovered these guys if indeed they promote Judo on the web for all to see and it teeters on if you like "picking on weak" then why post such poor vids? Thought the guy might be past his prime at first and even if he was then coach/teach his pupils to show the techniques to a reasonable standard.
    I'm sorry if I come across as ungentlemanly, 40yrs of Judo I have met plenty unworthy grades over the years, when I get on mats with solid Judoka I myself feel unworthy. Done loads of vids for pupils GCSE's over the years no need for me to star in them I just make sure what they do is solid to their capabilities.

    Lets have a look at an 8th dan, now its took him over 40yrs to achieve that and I was cannon fodder for him in my youth, I'm way unworthy.......

    Try 1.42

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpGipYUGWdw

    If thats more positive to discus then please feel free




    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Tue Aug 18, 2015 4:50 am

    BillC wrote:Medo ... you seem to just have discovered these guys ... this thread and the one you shared with NBK.  You might reconsider, maybe it's just too easy to pick on the weak.  Your posts might not come across as gentlemanly.  Plus, if these are the only candy belts you have ever seen operating without actually having met the usual requirements, then maybe it is your judo exposure that needs to widen a bit.  They are everywhere you look, including on the JF and this forum "the son of JF."

    If you are really interested, there is plenty of fuel for this fire over on bullshido.com.

    Sorry for the interruption, it might not be my place to have written this, but I look forward to your usual, more positive posts.

    Cheers.

    Bill

    Yes just discovered these guys if indeed they promote Judo on the web for all to see and it teeters on if you like "picking on weak" then why post such poor vids? Thought the guy might be past his prime at first and even if he was then coach/teach his pupils to show the techniques to a reasonable standard.
    I'm sorry if I come across as ungentlemanly, 40yrs of Judo I have met plenty unworthy grades over the years, when I get on mats with solid Judoka I myself feel unworthy. Done loads of vids for pupils GCSE's over the years no need for me to star in them I just make sure what they do is solid to their capabilities.

    Lets have a look at an 8th dan, now its took him over 40yrs to achieve that and I was cannon fodder for him in my youth, I'm way unworthy.......

    Try 1.42

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpGipYUGWdw

    If thats more positive to discus then please feel free




    Ben Reinhardt

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by Ben Reinhardt on Tue Aug 18, 2015 5:08 am

    The pity of it is that Karl Geiss was quite skilled at Judo, and he "produced" a lot of fine judoka who were excellent competitors/technicians. I would know, as I competed and trained against/with several of them, and trained at Karl's dojo a few times.

    Medo, I think you might observe the general posture of the guys in the back to get an idea of what they think of the demo you posted.

    And as BillC notes, there is a good thread over on bullshido.net regarding some of the later practices regarding rank promotions.


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    BillC

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by BillC on Tue Aug 18, 2015 5:25 am

    medo wrote:

    Yes just discovered these guys if indeed they promote Judo on the web for all to see and it teeters on if you like "picking on weak" then why post such poor vids? Thought the guy might be past his prime at first and even if he was then coach/teach his pupils to show the techniques to a reasonable standard.
    I'm sorry if I come across as ungentlemanly, 40yrs of Judo I have met plenty unworthy grades over the years, when I get on mats with solid Judoka I myself feel unworthy. Done loads of vids for pupils GCSE's over the years no need for me to star in them I just make sure what they do is solid to their capabilities.

    Lets have a look at an 8th dan, now its took him over 40yrs to achieve that and I was cannon fodder for him in my youth, I'm way unworthy.......

    Try 1.42

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpGipYUGWdw

    If thats more positive to discus then please feel free

    Yes, that is waaaay more positive.

    BTW ... should I "one up" you by noting that despite the youthful appearance of my avatar I have been studying judo for something like 46 years. Cool With diversions into karate (in those days Chuck Norris and Bruce Lee were WAY cooler than any judoka I knew) ... and aikido (50 girls and 2 guys not including sensei in the college course ... and I had a judo BROWN BELT ... need I say more?).

    Back on point, I have not understood some of the videos I have seen on the internet either. I am sympathetic with your discomfort. But it is like a car crash, very difficult to turn away.


    _________________
    Oh, East is East and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
    Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God's great Judgment Seat;
    But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
    When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!

    - Kipling

    tafftaz

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by tafftaz on Tue Aug 18, 2015 6:59 am

    Billc still the best avatar on the forum Very Happy

    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Tue Aug 18, 2015 7:13 am

    BillC wrote:
    medo wrote:

    Yes just discovered these guys if indeed they promote Judo on the web for all to see and it teeters on if you like "picking on weak" then why post such poor vids? Thought the guy might be past his prime at first and even if he was then coach/teach his pupils to show the techniques to a reasonable standard.
    I'm sorry if I come across as ungentlemanly, 40yrs of Judo I have met plenty unworthy grades over the years, when I get on mats with solid Judoka I myself feel unworthy. Done loads of vids for pupils GCSE's over the years no need for me to star in them I just make sure what they do is solid to their capabilities.

    Lets have a look at an 8th dan, now its took him over 40yrs to achieve that and I was cannon fodder for him in my youth, I'm way unworthy.......

    Try 1.42

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpGipYUGWdw

    If thats more positive to discus then please feel free

    Yes, that is waaaay more positive.

    BTW ... should I "one up" you by noting that despite the youthful appearance of my avatar I have been studying judo for something like 46 years. Cool  With diversions into karate (in those days Chuck Norris and Bruce Lee were WAY cooler than any judoka I knew) ... and aikido (50 girls and 2 guys not including sensei in the college course ... and I had a judo BROWN BELT ... need I say more?).

    Back on point, I have not understood some of the videos I have seen on the internet either.  I am sympathetic with your discomfort.  But it is like a car crash, very difficult to turn away.

    You got a few years on me always been Judo for me from the age of thirteen Just a stint at a taekwondo because I was dating a black belt there in my teens got to orange belt but she dumped me. So back to traveling the country for competitions and squad training...
    I do hope someone is getting something from these posts.

    tafftaz

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by tafftaz on Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:00 am

    Hi medo.
    I can truly understand your feelings toward the "8th dan" in the posted video. Truly awful technique. However he has to live with himself knowing that he is not up to standard unless he is truly delusional.
    As Bill rightly said, we have all seen charlatans like this at some time or another throughout our judo lives. I have my own stories about people like this but a pointless exercise writing about them. As long as my and my students judo is strong then I am happy.

    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Wed Aug 19, 2015 7:51 pm

    tafftaz wrote:Hi medo.
    I can truly understand your feelings toward the "8th dan" in the posted video. Truly awful technique. However he has to live with himself knowing that he is not up to standard unless he is truly delusional.
    As Bill rightly said, we have all seen charlatans like this at some time or another throughout our judo lives. I have my own stories about people like this but a pointless exercise writing about them. As long as my and my students judo is strong then I am happy.

    I don't know whether its a pointless exercise Jo public take their kids to an 8th dan in Judo they think this guys the real deal they know no better...

    Tafftaz why not share your experiences someone may learn from them? Heres one of mine

    As soon as I past my motorcycle test at 17 my Judogi fitted nicely into my tank bag and off I went searching clubs within a 50 mile radius I held different grades at that time BJA BJC AJA (naughty pirat  but it gave me more competitions/training at national level) most clubs were run by low dan grades who done their time with randori and happily passing on solid techniques often with their own interpretation (their tokui waza tends to suit them and build ect and they pass that on to their pupils).

    Then we have the high grade block belt non competitive clubs, won't call them Sensei although thats what they expected everyone in the club to call them I used to ring the instructor before turning up most would ask me my grade and I would go with my blue from the BJC always a safe bet and off I would go, one I remember introduced myself and joined in with the kids gently rolling around within minutes I would know whether it was worth returning when the seniors come on the mat I had a choice gently or show them JUDO by the time they were all armlock, strangled(never bothered holding them down) including the dan grades, then the ten minutes of randori at the end head straight for the dan grades, stiff arms all of them but straight under over they went and all thought I was brilliant, except the instructor who came over to me at the end and whispered that I should not return. I told him that he needed to start teaching them Judo In a loud voice so all could hear. Left my phone number with one off the dan grades outside and he came up to my main club and become my training partner together we explored more kata than I would have done on my own he moved down south and I have lost contact with him but a real good friend made from that one visit.

    tafftaz

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by tafftaz on Thu Aug 20, 2015 10:16 am

    Okay here goes.
    Welsh squad training years ago. Session was being taken by Duncan Kinnear.A very skilled judoka indeed and all round nice guy.
    Halfway thru the morning session adn large guy walked in proclaiming to be a 6th dan. the highest at the session at that time was 4th dan, all national level contest players. Duncan,being the gentleman that he is asked the guy if he would like to take the session seeing as he was the higher grade. The guy declined but said he would help out and correct any mistakes that Duncan made in his demonstrations or any we made as we practised.
    For clarity Duncan is a former national level competitor and a World silver medal holder for kata.
    No-one had ever seen this "6th dan" before so as seasoned players myself and a few of the other guys fancied some randori with him. He was young enough as he seemed to be inn his late thirties. Alarm bell should have started ringing then in hindsight.
    Anyway he started picking holes in Duncans session plan so we were all even more keen to try him out when randori was called.
    He then went on to criticize a guy called Daniel Davies,who had one of the finest uchimatas I have seen.
    He was then asked politely to show us where we were going wrong. Result was similar to the video you posted in the OP.
    That was it then, we knew that he was bullshitting and he grabbed his stuff and made his excuses and made a hurried exit before randori started as by now some of the nastier guys were baying for his blood. Now before people on this forum start spouting that the reactions were not the jusdo spirit, this was national squad training. For those that have never done randori at a similar level you have to realise that "nice" judo does not happen at these sessions. You train to win, plain and simple.
    I will have to give the guy credit though for having the audacity to come onto a mat with a red and white belt, that he clearly was not worthy of as technically he was at a green belt level by his techinque, and tell us all that our uchimata were incorrect.
    Had to laugh afterward though Very Happy

    Ricebale

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by Ricebale on Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:27 am

    Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers

    finarashi

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by finarashi on Fri Aug 21, 2015 3:30 pm

    Ricebale wrote:Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers
    But I/we do not claim to be 8th dan .. nor 6th dan ... nor 4th dan ...

    Nor do we claim that uchi-mata would be something we excel in


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    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Fri Aug 21, 2015 6:57 pm

    Ricebale wrote:Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers

    Think we all have problems with at least one throw mines harai tsuri komi ashi in demonstration always pick way lighter/compliant/good ukemi uke Wink been trying to get it spot on for 40yrs but still even with brilliant instruction over the years I perhaps do a good one say one in three..
    Uchimata can demonstrate at least a dozen entries and a leggy one like our 8th dan waayy better even on a stiff armed 100kg beginner.

    Take a look at all his videos and tell me he's worthy of no more than a kyu grade in my opinion.. Me thinks he talks Judo but has never ever actually done Judo....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdTDDLy-8aw

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnErtAcPDe8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz4AtgjL9_E

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=714oXm-ZcF0

    Laughing

    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:05 pm

    Can I ask what grade are Swain and Pedro at present across the pond?

    Ricebale

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by Ricebale on Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:27 pm

    medo wrote:
    Ricebale wrote:Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers

    Think we all have problems with at least one throw mines harai tsuri komi ashi in demonstration always pick way lighter/compliant/good ukemi uke Wink been trying to get it spot on for 40yrs but still even with brilliant instruction over the years I perhaps do a good one say one in three..
    Uchimata can demonstrate at least a dozen entries and a leggy one like our 8th dan waayy better even on a stiff armed 100kg beginner.

    Take a look at all his videos and tell me he's worthy of no more than a kyu grade in my opinion.. Me thinks he talks Judo but has never ever actually done Judo....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdTDDLy-8aw

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnErtAcPDe8

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz4AtgjL9_E

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=714oXm-ZcF0

    Laughing

    Pretty much. I'm quite confident that any random person who posts here could display higher technical merit without rehersal, the video would undoubtedly show this, hence my suspicions that this person is not a Judoka or perhaps he has had a stroke or is otherwise mentally unstable.

    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:49 pm

    finarashi wrote:
    Ricebale wrote:Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers
    But I/we do not claim to be 8th dan .. nor 6th dan ... nor 4th dan ...

    Nor do we claim that uchi-mata would be something we excel in

    I think myself and others took your post as a positive for the the demo in the OP!!

    finarashi

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by finarashi on Sat Aug 22, 2015 12:45 am

    medo wrote:
    finarashi wrote:
    Ricebale wrote:Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers
    But I/we do not claim to be 8th dan .. nor 6th dan ... nor 4th dan ...

    Nor do we claim that uchi-mata would be something we excel in

    I think myself and others took your post as a positive for the the demo in the OP!!
    Yes, if you are a high dan and think you are qualified to instruct everybody on their uchi-mata then please do a video on your own uchimata and post it here!

    If you (like myself) never have excelled in uchimata then refrain from posting but please still keep instructing lower grades.


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    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Sat Aug 22, 2015 2:06 am

    finarashi wrote:
    medo wrote:
    finarashi wrote:
    Ricebale wrote:Easy solved.
    Grab a camera.
    Film yourselves doing uchi mata without rehersal.
    Post it here.
    It should speak for itself.
    Cheers
    But I/we do not claim to be 8th dan .. nor 6th dan ... nor 4th dan ...

    Nor do we claim that uchi-mata would be something we excel in

    I think myself and others took your post as a positive for the the demo in the OP!!
    Yes, if you are a high dan and think you are qualified to instruct everybody on their uchi-mata then please do a video on your own uchimata and post it here!

    If you (like myself) never have excelled in uchimata then refrain from posting but please still keep instructing lower grades.  

    As you get older mobility and speed tends to lapse but by then you should have developed the necessary skills to identify the key principles behind the throw.. You instruct accordingly. As your pupils begin to explore the throw you put right flaws in their technique and adapt the technique for their age/build/skill level.
    No one would expect a low dan grade to demonstrate all throws to a very high standard nor would you expect an older high grade to display techniques as he would in his prime but no way would he loose the basic principles!!!!!!!!!! He was doing the throw in full cooperation with the person taking the vid whether he meant that to be displayed on youtube we don't know but clearly by the clapping in the vids someone thinks its to a high standard I know the grades standing in uchimata vid in the background do not look enthralled.  I'm afraid I would have left and found somewhere else. But if I stayed for a few years while training somewhere else I could be a Rukodan before I was thirty banghead

    I believe Mike Swain and Jimmy Pedro are 6th dans do you think their demonstrations would be better than 8th dan Ivans??

    medo

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    Re: uchimata

    Post by medo on Sat Aug 22, 2015 2:54 am

    Perhaps we in the Judo community have a little to much Ju and not enough Do

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZ3eiinYchg

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