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    Hanon

    Posts : 537
    Join date : 2012-12-31

    How to make best use of a forum

    Post by Hanon on Sat Jan 26, 2013 12:14 am

    May I start by making it crystal clear I am a complete novice in the world of IT.

    Ones forum profile, lets debate.

    Gender; Does it matter? What use is such information? Judo is practiced my both sexes and both have an absolute parity in terms of the ability to write on the subject.

    Age; People of all ages practice judo. Being 21 does not preclude a poster from being knowledgeable about the subject of judo, Being 80 does NOT mean that person has a copyright to all that is written on judo nor, in reality, may be even competent to write on the subject.

    Country; Does that affect how a persons post should be read, if so how? A tatami in ABCland is the same as a tatami in Qwertyland. This is one of the core aims of judo bringing us together s one body.

    Profession; Does this matter? When we debate judo is it not judo that becomes the subject that is common to us all?

    Hobbies; I would guess judo would be the reason one joins a judo forum so its a safe gues to assume the poster is here to debate the subject at some level?

    Humour; ??? That one takes the biscuit for me, never mind, let it go...

    Religion; Judo doesn't have one. If we do that is our personal matter and nothing whatsoever to do with what or how we interact toward each other in judo be it here or in real life. On times ones religion can be a barrier toward building bridges that is a key area where judo can be used to build and destroy barriers by bringing us together as a human race and not a set of labels


    Rank; Pointless question. This cannot be verified unless the said forum has a mass of admin people who are willing to accept written proof of rank, .More, There are kyu ranks who have written a far more intelligible post than some rather senior ranks have been capable of. Rank has been debated on judo forums for ever. EVEN IF we establish our ranks does this mean what we write is factual and correct and therefore in no need of further research and debate? Absurd notion. It is my experience that a poster value to judo debate, NOT THE RANK, shines through a post by its content. I am going to write the obvious. We are all pupils of judo, no one knows judo. Judoka grow with learned practice and maturity. What I wrote ten or even five years ago should have developed due to my further practice and growth in understand and knowledge.

    Name; Okay lets have a forum rule where only posters may post using real names no nick names. How on earth can this be verified? Again the admin staff would need to have offices and in what way can we prove who we are? Copy of a pass port or ID card? For what to debate on a forum? More, an known poster can write as a known idiot whereas an unknown poster can write with the wisdom of Solomon. I have seen a a few posters write that they will not accept what a given poster has written if they don't know who wrote the post? Think about this there are several million people involved in judo. How can we know each other? lets take another scenario we accept that john Smith IS john Smith, how does that fact change the value of his post, John Smith could be a genius or a complete moron, THE only way to asses that is by the content of the post NOT who wrote it? ID theft. Personal vendetta, The council for internet security strongly advices people to give the minimum information possible when using the net. I am informed that ID theft is now the biggest 'white collar crime in the USA and Europe. I don't want to know who you are I respect my own ability to read what you write and base my judo opinions on that fact alone.

    The above is written in regard to a judo forum, an exchange of opinions on a hobby. IF some one wants to marry one of my daughters or is asking me to invest money in their business that becomes an entirely different matter. Logical, practical, intelligent perspective is needed on this new forum

    As Yet I have not seen or read any forum guidelines or rules here. I respectfully suggest that these rules are a priority for the admins here. it will be difficult to enforce a rule that does not yet exist.

    A general word on form posting. Like it or not. Agree with it or not. There is only one way to asses the value of a poster on a forum and it is not there gender, age rank or any other information taken from there profile its in the content of their posts and how they conduct themselves on a forum.

    PLEASE FORGIVE ME when I write that on times I have been so embarrassed on behalf of a poster who has written in the middle of a debate that he will not listen to a given poster unless he knows who they are and their rank? That informs any person with any level of intellect that the person requesting such information does not have the ability or knowledge or....brains....to read a post and use it for what it is.

    I don't want to know any profile information regarding a fellow poster. I am deeply interested in what they write and how they write it.

    Harmony and cyber friendship though debate comes from just that, debate. This is not the real world its the internet and it has taken me some years myself to realise that fact. If we cannot accept its limitations best w stay away from such a media?

    Please think about this.

    Mike


    Last edited by Hanon on Sat Jan 26, 2013 12:46 am; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : Addition, spelling, then grammar.)


    _________________
    WARNING. I write as a pupil of judo. what I write should be researched by the reader and not accepted as in any way factual or correct.

    "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge" S Hawking.
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    Quicksilver

    Posts : 93
    Join date : 2012-12-29
    Location : Right here.

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by Quicksilver on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:33 am

    I am currently viewing this post on a mobile phone with a touch sensitive screen, and I accidentally brushed the '-', (currently accounting for 50% of the votes and the only negative one); my apologies, it was unintentional and should please be disregarded.

    I am in the process of writing a proper reply which I shall post tomorrow (or rather, later today; it's past 3am here bounce ).

    Regards

    -Q
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    heikojr

    Posts : 91
    Join date : 2013-01-01
    Age : 48
    Location : NY

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by heikojr on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:10 am

    Please read to the end.

    At my dojo, not everyone is there to learn judo. Some people are there to fight, some people are there to meet people (socialize), some people are there because they've done judo their whole life, some people are training for their next tournament, some are there to learn judo, some are there for the next rank, ect, ect, ect. Yes, i want them all there to learn judo, but i have come to accept that judo is done for a wide variety of reasons... and some i like some i don't. The reason we all meet is the thing that is common: Judo.

    The forum is the same way.

    heikojr



    P.S. For someone who is a complete novice you did a great job copying and pasting in article from Spiegel. You're not that much of a novice here or at Judo!
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    genetic judoka

    Posts : 541
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    Age : 31
    Location : Florida

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by genetic judoka on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:20 am

    some like having additional info available, some don't. the thing is you're not forced to look for information on people's profile, nor are you forced to trust the information on anyone's profile, you're not even forced to trust the info on your own profile. if you were to claim you were a 324th dan, we'd probably all get a laugh out of it, and then move on.

    personally I find it useful. if you don't want to know about a person's background, nobody is forcing you to look into it. you still have the option of evaluating a post based on it's content. the thing is, and you might not realize that this is what you sound like you're saying, but to me it sounds like you're saying that since you don't want to know the info a person wishes to share about themselves, that none of us who do want to know a bit about a poster before replying to them should have the ability to find out what it is that they choose to share. now I hope that's not what you mean, because that sounds pretty selfish, and with your history of being willing to spend your time writing long answers to difficult questions, you never struck me as being a selfish individual. needless to say I find myself quite confused.


    _________________
    Warning: I am very opinionated, and very willing to share that opinion. However I am very much aware that I am here as a student, not a teacher.

    Hanon

    Posts : 537
    Join date : 2012-12-31

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by Hanon on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:42 am

    genetic judoka wrote:some like having additional info available, some don't. the thing is you're not forced to look for information on people's profile, nor are you forced to trust the information on anyone's profile, you're not even forced to trust the info on your own profile. if you were to claim you were a 324th dan, we'd probably all get a laugh out of it, and then move on.

    personally I find it useful. if you don't want to know about a person's background, nobody is forcing you to look into it. you still have the option of evaluating a post based on it's content. the thing is, and you might not realize that this is what you sound like you're saying, but to me it sounds like you're saying that since you don't want to know the info a person wishes to share about themselves, that none of us who do want to know a bit about a poster before replying to them should have the ability to find out what it is that they choose to share. now I hope that's not what you mean, because that sounds pretty selfish, and with your history of being willing to spend your time writing long answers to difficult questions, you never struck me as being a selfish individual. needless to say I find myself quite confused.

    Hiya,

    Thank you for bringing this oversight to my attention. If a poster WANTS to write their CV, or whatever, that is their decision and fine for them. I am questioning the value of such information and relying upon it to evaluate or validate a posters information? Eg, on the JF I joined and like a fool gave my name and rank. Posted about a national coach, made a negative comment and with a week I was carpeted by the federation here. Second point. I used to post my rank. Big mistake. I was then either branded a 'tin God', guru or told I didn't know judo, neither are the case I am not a guru but do have a little judo knowledge. To avoid any Guru, purist, Bishop crap here I have deliberately posted myself as a 7th kyu, a novice. This way I cannot be labeled as some bishop or whatever as I am a 7th kyu.

    In my case I would like my peers to read my posts and either debate them with me or ignore them and not get personal.

    I should have made it clear that there can be zero objection to a poster posting whatever they desire in their profile. I was suggesting such information is next to useless and can be misused.

    Thanks for the heads up. It is wise to keep an eye on me and thank you for looking after me and taking the time to debate my post. This is what we need here. Simple polite debate.

    Hug,

    Mike


    _________________
    WARNING. I write as a pupil of judo. what I write should be researched by the reader and not accepted as in any way factual or correct.

    "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge" S Hawking.

    Hanon

    Posts : 537
    Join date : 2012-12-31

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by Hanon on Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:55 am

    heikojr wrote:Please read to the end.

    heikojr


    P.S. For someone who is a complete novice you did a great job copying and pasting in article from Spiegel. You're not that much of a novice here or at Judo!

    Helooooo,

    I tell you what. I was an admin on the makoto forum. I got overconfident one evening and thought I would do some 'house cleaning' I ended up deleting about 100 accounts and a load of posts.

    I opened a You tube account so I could post some clips as I promised a few posters I would do so. It took me months. Steep learning curve but I made it and posted about 15 clips. I tried not long ago to add a commentary and lost the lot even, I think, my account!

    I was more surprised than you to see I had successfully copied and posted a clip from the net.

    Regarding judo, to this day I get confused with my Hidari and Migi and can never remember what the difference it between Tsugi ashi and tsuri ashi, I always get the names confused. 50 years of judo last year! Still made the simplest of mistakes.

    Mike


    _________________
    WARNING. I write as a pupil of judo. what I write should be researched by the reader and not accepted as in any way factual or correct.

    "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge" S Hawking.
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    heikojr

    Posts : 91
    Join date : 2013-01-01
    Age : 48
    Location : NY

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by heikojr on Sat Jan 26, 2013 5:24 am

    Hanon wrote:
    I was more surprised than you to see I had successfully copied and posted a clip from the net.

    Regarding judo, to this day I get confused with my Hidari and Migi and can never remember what the difference it between Tsugi ashi and tsuri ashi, I always get the names confused. 50 years of judo last year! Still made the simplest of mistakes.

    Mike

    You did a better job than i could have with the article!

    As for judo, even monkeys fall from trees...

    All the best!

    heikojr
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    Judo Dad

    Posts : 147
    Join date : 2013-01-01
    Location : Australia

    E-Judo as a Judo network & forum

    Post by Judo Dad on Sat Jan 26, 2013 10:22 am

    Gender & Age: If the post is in health & Fitness then Gender and age may be relevant

    Country: If I am looking to buy tatami for a new club then a great deal on mats in Seattle is probably not what I am looking for when I am based in Melbourne.

    Profession and Hobbies: If E-Judo is a network then knowing what skills are out there is handy for networking. A lawyer may be able to advise on liability issues for example.


    Having said all this I think this is getting a bit like the previous thread on using real names which was quite rightly locked.

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    afulldeck

    Posts : 377
    Join date : 2012-12-30

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by afulldeck on Sat Jan 26, 2013 1:53 pm

    genetic judoka wrote:
    ..........personally I find it useful.......

    its Friday evening, I'm drinking whiskey, so let's hope my post make sense.

    Deciding to read or not read any post, based on a profile is a mistake. Its another form of the logical fallacy (argumentum ad verecundiam) called appealing to authority. It does not matter if what you read in the profile makes that individual an 'expert' or 'a novice'. Its a fallacy to use the profile in the process of evaluating the post because your judgement is 'pre framed' on the authority or lack of and not the content of argument written.

    That said, its nice to read a profile and have the belief that you know the person or understand where he is coming from, but that too would only be a belief.

    In my estimation, its better to simply read and rely on your own judgement of the writing.

    Yes the whiskey is good....Albert Premium Dark.....
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    genetic judoka

    Posts : 541
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    Age : 31
    Location : Florida

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by genetic judoka on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:15 pm

    afulldeck wrote:
    genetic judoka wrote:
    ..........personally I find it useful.......

    its Friday evening, I'm drinking whiskey, so let's hope my post make sense.

    Deciding to read or not read any post, based on a profile is a mistake. Its another form of the logical fallacy (argumentum ad verecundiam) called appealing to authority. It does not matter if what you read in the profile makes that individual an 'expert' or 'a novice'. Its a fallacy to use the profile in the process of evaluating the post because your judgement is 'pre framed' on the authority or lack of and not the content of argument written.

    That said, its nice to read a profile and have the belief that you know the person or understand where he is coming from, but that too would only be a belief.

    In my estimation, its better to simply read and rely on your own judgement of the writing.

    Yes the whiskey is good....Albert Premium Dark.....

    I never said I decide to read a post or not depending on what a profile says. but if someone comes on and says "I think the state of judo education is in need of overhaul, it's far to rough." and I look at their profile and it turns out they've been to 3 classes, I'm just gonna file that under the 'people who can't take it' folder, but if I look on their profile and it says that they've been doing judo for 20 years, then maybe they are commenting on changes they've seen over the course of their time on the mat.

    or say someone comes on and says "I'm struggling with the kuzushi of harai goshi" and the profile (or the post if we're so lucky) says that they're a yellow belt, then the most useful answer is "just hang in there and listen to your sensei, it's not a throw you'll master overnight." but if their profile (or again the post if we're lucky) says they're a nidan who teaches their own class, then maybe it's an issue of refinement, in which case a long and detailed post will warranted, whereas in the first example going into a 12 paragraph explanation of the finer points of the kuzushi of harai goshi would go right over their heads. it's about how to help someone best. now if they choose not to fill it in, we have no choice but to take the post at face value and do our best.

    just my thoughts on the matter, feel free to debate.
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    judoratt

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    Age : 60
    Location : Seattle

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by judoratt on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:29 pm

    I think this horse is on life support Very Happy
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    BillC

    Posts : 806
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    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by BillC on Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:59 pm

    judoratt wrote:I think this horse is on life support Very Happy

    When life hands you lemons, make lemonade.

    When life hands you dead horse make ...



    Forums expand one's world, neh?
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    judoratt

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    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by judoratt on Sat Jan 26, 2013 6:30 pm

    BillC wrote:
    judoratt wrote:I think this horse is on life support Very Happy

    When life hands you lemons, make lemonade.

    When life hands you dead horse make ...



    Forums expand one's world, neh?

    I will never forget eating Horse Sashimi August 1991 in a little restaurant across the street from the KDK entrance with Bob Harder life long cowboy. After eating the horse Bob said " Some of my best friends have been horses" Very Happy:D

    BTW Horse also has a cut of meat that looks just like a T bone steak. Surprised:o
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    BillC

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    Location : Vista, California

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by BillC on Sat Jan 26, 2013 7:05 pm

    judoratt wrote:
    I will never forget eating Horse Sashimi August 1991 in a little restaurant across the street from the KDK entrance with Bob Harder life long cowboy. After eating the horse Bob said " Some of my best friends have been horses" Very Happy:D

    BTW Horse also has a cut of meat that looks just like a T bone steak. Surprised:o

    You mean the place kitty-corner across the big intersection? The place with Colby's drawing hanging in the stairwell? It's still open. Haven't eaten horse there though.

    The problem with horse sashimi is that it tastes like ... well ... horse. Just the slightest note of a sweaty horse on a hot summer day. My grandfather is apparently in the rodeo hall of fame but I would rather walk than ride. Never liked the smelly, temperamental beasts much.

    Me? Like I like whale. Tastes like raw bacon. Yum!

    I think we more than derailed this thread ...

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    Judo Dad

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    Location : Australia

    Re: How to make best use of a forum

    Post by Judo Dad on Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:51 pm

    BillC wrote:
    judoratt wrote:
    I will never forget eating Horse Sashimi August 1991 in a little restaurant across the street from the KDK entrance with Bob Harder life long cowboy. After eating the horse Bob said " Some of my best friends have been horses" Very Happy:D

    BTW Horse also has a cut of meat that looks just like a T bone steak. Surprised:o

    You mean the place kitty-corner across the big intersection? The place with Colby's drawing hanging in the stairwell? It's still open. Haven't eaten horse there though.

    The problem with horse sashimi is that it tastes like ... well ... horse. Just the slightest note of a sweaty horse on a hot summer day. My grandfather is apparently in the rodeo hall of fame but I would rather walk than ride. Never liked the smelly, temperamental beasts much.

    Me? Like I like whale. Tastes like raw bacon. Yum!

    I think we more than derailed this thread ...




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