E-Judo

Judo network and forum


    This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Share

    Toptomcat

    Posts : 1
    Join date : 2013-04-19

    This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by Toptomcat on Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:54 am

    This video of Katsuhiko Kashiwazaki doing what is presented as 'tomoe nage' has me confused. Many of the throws he demonstrates appear to use the instep as a lever on uke's inner thigh, like sumi gaeshi, rather than planting the foot on uke's waist or hip, like a 'classic' tomoe nage. When I asked a more experienced judoka about it, he said that they were indeed all tomoe nage, and that the entry and the pull with the hands are the principally important thing that distinguishes tomoe nage from sumi gaeshi, not just foot placement.

    While I knew that the typical entry and pull for those throws is importantly different, the notion that foot placement is a mere bagatelle is kind of a new one on me. Can anyone here help me out?

    JudoStu

    Posts : 212
    Join date : 2013-01-04
    Age : 44
    Location : UK

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by JudoStu on Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:25 am

    I can’t comment on whether foot placement is a mere bagatelle in Tomae-nage but that is some mighty fine Judo on display there.


    _________________
    Judo is only gentle for the guy on top

    tafftaz

    Posts : 330
    Join date : 2012-12-31
    Age : 51
    Location : Wales, UK

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by tafftaz on Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:00 am

    Toptomcat wrote:This video of Katsuhiko Kashiwazaki doing what is presented as 'tomoe nage' has me confused. Many of the throws he demonstrates appear to use the instep as a lever on uke's inner thigh, like sumi gaeshi, rather than planting the foot on uke's waist or hip, like a 'classic' tomoe nage. When I asked a more experienced judoka about it, he said that they were indeed all tomoe nage, and that the entry and the pull with the hands are the principally important thing that distinguishes tomoe nage from sumi gaeshi, not just foot placement.

    While I knew that the typical entry and pull for those throws is importantly different, the notion that foot placement is a mere bagatelle is kind of a new one on me. Can anyone here help me out?


    Watch it closely again. There were not many foot placement on the inner thigh in the video. Most were placed in and around the hip/lower abdomen area. He is just so quick when he does the throw..Also the judoka you asked were correct. The foot is a secondary measure. the throw should be almost complete by using your hands while sacrificing your body position.Uke should be past the brink of balance before the foot makes contact.
    I have a lot of Kashiwazaki videos on tomoenage as it is my tokui waza, but not this one.
    Thanks for posting. The man is a genius.

    Ricebale

    Posts : 423
    Join date : 2013-01-01
    Location : Wollongong Australia

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by Ricebale on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:08 pm

    Very nice video, I love the sacrifice throws and especially the transitions into arm bars

    This looks like the follow up video:



    Very good training technique for the tomoe nage throw, breaks down the steps and shows the foot is not the focus part of the throw.

    cheers


    Last edited by Ricebale on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:11 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added vid)

    hedgehogey

    Posts : 103
    Join date : 2012-12-30

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by hedgehogey on Sat Apr 20, 2013 6:43 am



    I'm trying the flying wombat defense today.


    Last edited by genetic judoka on Sat Apr 20, 2013 6:50 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : properly embed video)

    genetic judoka

    Posts : 541
    Join date : 2012-12-30
    Age : 30
    Location : Florida

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by genetic judoka on Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:08 am

    hedgehogey wrote:

    I'm trying the flying wombat defense today.
    most ridiculous looking thing I've seen all day. with that said I may try that tonight too.


    _________________
    Warning: I am very opinionated, and very willing to share that opinion. However I am very much aware that I am here as a student, not a teacher.

    Res Judicata

    Posts : 9
    Join date : 2013-04-20

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by Res Judicata on Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:35 am

    I've seen Matsumura Yochiro (8 dan) do something similar. It's pretty funny and it works--so long as you're great.

    still learning

    Posts : 125
    Join date : 2013-01-20
    Age : 47
    Location : South Wales UK

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by still learning on Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:10 am

    genetic judoka wrote:
    hedgehogey wrote:

    I'm trying the flying wombat defense today.
    most ridiculous looking thing I've seen all day. with that said I may try that tonight too.

    Despite all the skill HSM for the leg grab!

    JudoMojo

    Posts : 46
    Join date : 2012-12-29
    Location : UK

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by JudoMojo on Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:09 am

    I don't see any sumi gaeshi in the video, there is no sumi gaeshi 'rolling' action. It is hard to see where the foot is, but the throw is clearly tomoenage to my eyes.

    genetic judoka

    Posts : 541
    Join date : 2012-12-30
    Age : 30
    Location : Florida

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by genetic judoka on Sun Apr 21, 2013 4:13 am

    well I tried the counter I said I was gonna try, and it was quite effective, minus the whole HSM thing...


    _________________
    Warning: I am very opinionated, and very willing to share that opinion. However I am very much aware that I am here as a student, not a teacher.

    Sponsored content

    Re: This Kashiwazaki video has me confused about what a tomoe nage is

    Post by Sponsored content Today at 6:58 pm


      Current date/time is Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:58 pm