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    Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

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    Jonesy

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    Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Jonesy on Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:09 am

    I was there......





    Fiona McT

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Fiona McT on Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:43 am

    Why did Angelo change from representing Great Britain in the 1972 Olympics to representing France in 1980 Olympics? Granted he married a French woman and he took up French citizenship in 1975, but why change?

    Why didn't Angelo participate in the 1976 Olympics?
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    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Mon Jun 10, 2013 3:11 am

    Fiona McT wrote:Why did Angelo change from representing Great Britain in the 1972 Olympics to representing France in 1980 Olympics? Granted he married a French woman and he took up French citizenship in 1975, but why change?

    You could similarly wonder why even represent Great Britain in the 1972 Olympics and take up British citizenship instead of representing Italy ?


    Fiona McT wrote:Why didn't Angelo participate in the 1976 Olympics?

    Restriction of representation/citizenship rules at that time. It's different now.

    I would imagine that there are all kinds of other private and other rules that have affected those choices. As you probably know, citizenship rules can great differ between countries, which is why sometimes people take double or even triple citizenship, while in other cases doing so is impossible because the new country or the old country do not allow multiple citizenship.

    It also appears that depending on the individual, people have either strong or much less strong feelings towards their original citizenship. I know of one female judoka who was screwed over big time because of politics and the federation not selecting her. It became worse when one a-hole Board male member offended her and she ô-soto-gari'd the idiot to the floor after which the federation suspended her. She went to court twice all the way to the European Court of Justice, but lost. She didn't have a leg to stand on, but anyhow. She could have easily avoided all this nonsense by changing citizenship as in most countries she would have easily wiped out all competition in her weightclass. Unfortunately, she never did, and so her career was destroyed. Why didn't she ? I have no idea, but others like the Georgian Jarji Zviadauri (better known under his Hellenized name and fighting under Greek flag) went for the opposite choice and did so very successfully.


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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Fiona McT on Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:30 am

    Great Britain was the natural choice for Angelo in 1972. He grew up in England, started judo as a child in England, initially with Brian Jacks' father, was always a part of the British judo system. At age 19 in 1972 he won Bronze in the Olympics. Why did he then abandon Great Britain? Was it because of some sort of personal animosity?

    Jarji Zviadauri won Gold in the European Youth Olympics in 2001, Gold in the European Cadet Championsips in 2002, Bronze in the European Junior Championships in 2002 and got 5th in the A-Tournament in Tiblisi in 2003 and Gold in the European U23 Championships in 2003 all at -73 kg. The National judo coach in Greece, who previously lived in Georgia, Nikos Iliadis needed credible judoka for the upcoming 2004 Olympics in Athens. He suggested, so the story goes, that Jarji become Greek and represent Greece, as he had no prospects at all of representing Georgia in 2004. Becoming Greek in time for the 2004 Olympics was not a problem as the Greek law stipulated that anyone under the age of 18 who was adopted by a Greek citizen automatically received Greek citizenship within 90 days. An agreement was apparently reached and Nikos adopted Jarji. Jarji's name was then changed to Ilias Iliadis. It is unlikely that anyone imagined that this boy would develop so quickly and win Gold at -81 kg in the 2004 Olympics. There have been persistent rumors that Jarji's Georgian documents were falsified to prove that he was still under 18 in order qualify for Greek citizenship under Greek law, when in reality he was several years older. This would not affect the credibility of his Olympic medal, but would affect his Cadet and Junior medals.
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    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Mon Jun 10, 2013 7:42 am

    Fiona McT wrote:Great Britain was the natural choice for Angelo in 1972. He grew up in England, started judo as a child in England, initially with Brian Jacks' father, was always a part of the British judo system. At age 19 in 1972 he won Bronze in the Olympics. Why did he then abandon Great Britain? Was it because of some sort of personal animosity?

    Jarji Zviadauri won Gold in the European Youth Olympics in 2001, Gold in the European Cadet Championsips in 2002, Bronze in the European Junior Championships in 2002 and got 5th in the A-Tournament in Tiblisi in 2003 and Gold in the European U23 Championships in 2003 all at -73 kg. The National judo coach in Greece, who previously lived in Georgia, Nikos Iliadis needed credible judoka for the upcoming 2004 Olympics in Athens. He suggested, so the story goes, that Jarji become Greek and represent Greece, as he had no prospects at all of representing Georgia in 2004. Becoming Greek in time for the 2004 Olympics was not a problem as the Greek law stipulated that anyone under the age of 18 who was adopted by a Greek citizen automatically received Greek citizenship within 90 days. An agreement was apparently reached and Nikos adopted Jarji. Jarji's name was then changed to Ilias Iliadis. It is unlikely that anyone imagined that this boy would develop so quickly and win Gold at -81 kg in the 2004 Olympics. There have been persistent rumors that Jarji's Georgian documents were falsified to prove that he was still under 18 in order qualify for Greek citizenship under Greek law, when in reality he was several years older. This would not affect the credibility of his Olympic medal, but would affect his Cadet and Junior medals.

    I have been told the answers to your question in detail, but I am not sure that this would be information that is available in the public domain, but instead may cross the line when it comes to privacy. Secondly, I have no way of verifying the veracity of that information I was told. And, thirdly, to be honest I would not be sure if I would attempt to relay the information that I would have all my facts straight.

    However, to be less unhelpful to you, wasn't some of that addressed anywhere either in an interview with him in a magazine or in that YouTube documentary that I once posted on the old forum ?

    With regard to the issue of changing citizenship, I have seen all kinds of things happen particularly in big money sports. How many of those Russian female tennis players have not ended up in the US in a quick and rather simply way, whereas tens of thousand can't even legitimately get their family member into the US after more than a decade of waiting. Soccer is even worse. How many soccer players have not been fast-tracked for citizenship with minimal time of residency skipped, even in some cases parliamentary sessions specially organized to push through the naturalization of a specific soccer player (in countries where parliament needs to be involved in the granting of citizenship). No one 'kicked' (no pun intended) about the things they do there, probably because politicians themselves are thousand times more likely to be great soccer fans than judo fanatics unless their name is Putin.


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    Fiona McT

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Fiona McT on Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:10 am

    Anyone else care to comment?
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    Freelancer

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Freelancer on Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:31 am

    My comment is that I admire Angelo's o guruma. I rarely see that technique used so well in shiai.


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    finarashi

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by finarashi on Mon Jun 10, 2013 4:58 pm

    Didn't Elco van der Geest? change his representation from Netherland to Belgium? or am I mixing him with some other heavy?

    AFAIK Angelo Parisi is the only judoka who has represented three countries in international competitions.


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    Davaro

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Davaro on Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:42 pm

    I feel for the victim who became the reels last highlight.... I wonder if he was accredited with any airmiles.

    Was that you Jonesy?


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    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:50 am

    finarashi wrote:Didn't Elco van der Geest? change his representation from Netherland to Belgium? or am I mixing him with some other heavy?

    Correct, and the only reason being to be able to avoid the competition for selection in his original country. There is, of course, nothing wrong with doing so. It is perfectly in agreement with the law and rules. As we are bordering the line of privacy, this is information that is widely available in the public domain and which both his federation in press releases as he himself in interviews has released.

    finarashi wrote:AFAIK Angelo Parisi is the only judoka who has represented three countries in international competitions.

    I am not sure at all that this is true, but Parisi is no doubt the most well-known due to his great success and spectacular jûdô. I am sure there are others in similar cases, but who might never have medalled or have remained largely unknown to the jûdô community.


    Last edited by Cichorei Kano on Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:02 am; edited 1 time in total


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    finarashi

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by finarashi on Tue Jun 11, 2013 1:38 am

    Cichorei Kano wrote:

    finarashi wrote:AFAIK Angelo Parisi is the only judoka who has represented three countries in international competitions.

    I am not sure at all that this is true, but Parisi is no doubt the most well-known due to his great success and spectacular jûdô. I am sure there are others in similar cases, but who might never have medalled or have remained largely unknown to the jûdô community.
    I think we covered this in the old forum ... but the first instance is him representing Italy in Cadet European championships then England and finally France, all in highest level of Judo. I agree that in lower levels there probably are others.



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    rjohnston411

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by rjohnston411 on Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:13 am

    van der Geest changing citizenship is no worse than Illiadis.

    Also, Parisi has awesome techniques. He is so unusual and yet still often 'textbook'. Definitely. A favourite
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    Jonesy

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Jonesy on Tue Jun 11, 2013 8:50 am

    It should also be noted that Ilias Iliadis is Georgian-born though I believe he has only represented Greece - the cpuntry of his adopted father.

    Also, Daniel Lascau is Romanian-born and represented Romania at some level before moving to, and representing, Germany.


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    Cichorei Kano

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Cichorei Kano on Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:23 am

    Jonesy wrote:It should also be noted that Ilias Iliadis is Georgian-born though I believe he has only represented Greece - the cpuntry of his adopted father.

    Also, Daniel Lascau is Romanian-born and represented Romania at some level before moving to, and representing, Germany.

    What about the soccer and basketball teams, half of the are imported these days, aren't they ?


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    "The world is a republic of mediocrities, and always was." (Thomas Carlyle)
    "Nothing is as approved as mediocrity, the majority has established it and it fixes it fangs on whatever gets beyond it either way." (Blaise Pascal)
    "Quand on essaie, c'est difficile. Quand on n'essaie pas, c'est impossible" (Guess Who ?)
    "I am never wrong. Once I thought I was, and that was a mistake."

    Fiona McT

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Fiona McT on Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:19 am

    Jonesy wrote:It should also be noted that Ilias Iliadis is Georgian-born though I believe he has only represented Greece - the cpuntry of his adopted father.

    Iliadis represented Georgia, as I stated on this thread; for example, in the EYOF in Murcia, Spain, in 2001, under his Georgian name Jarji Zviadauri. See
    Georgian Judo Medals, EYOF 2001
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    Jihef

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    Re: Anglo Parisi 1 vs. 10

    Post by Jihef on Tue Jul 05, 2016 12:38 am

    cyclops
    A recent (april 2016) video from Angelo Parisi.

    Angelo Parisi, le premier lourd du judo français


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